There is NO Plan B with Thomas Alascio

Intro [00:00:01]:

Welcome to the elite recruiter podcast with your host, Benjamin Menna, where we focus on what it takes to win in the recruiting game. We cover it all from sales, marketing, mindset, money, leadership, and placements.

Benjamin Mena [00:00:19]:

Before we get started, few things on the horizon. First of all, I'm pulling together some of the amazing speakers that we've had recently for online summit to help you guys really finish off the year strong, and then we're gonna do another one right at the beginning of the year to help you launch the best year ever. And on top of that, we are putting together the elite recruiter community, So keep an eye on that soon. We'll be able able to interact with other listeners, ask some questions, you know, get a chance to chat with some of the the speakers. But excited for you guys to for all that and to listen to this amazing podcast. I'm excited about this episode of the Elite Recruiter podcast. I have one of my friends, Tom Alessio, Here on the podcast to share about some of the things he's doing, but, like, most importantly, Tom has been such a community builder within the recruiting space. He is constantly giving and giving and helping other recruiters out.

Benjamin Mena [00:01:11]:

Every week he holds a roundtable. In the different recruiting groups, he's, Always giving his input, always giving answers, and helping out other recruiters. So I I want to bring him on to talk about up leveling The the community, giving back to the community, but also, like, his background, he's got a really good story about how he has gotten successful. And on top of this, like, yeah, Tom, you're having might be one of your best years ever this year.

Thomas Alascio [00:01:38]:

At best years as, independent, like, on my own firm. Right? So, yeah, I I could max out what we did in 2001, right, which was 636,000 when I worked at an MRI office. So I couldn't exceed that this year. But, yeah, my best year is, I mean, the firm.

Benjamin Mena [00:01:59]:

And that's also some one of the reasons why I wanted to bring you on to chat is, like, it's very it's been a very interesting, Unique, challenging year in recruiting, but you you have found ways to win. But before we dive into all that, The number 1 question that we get started with, how did you even end up in the recruiting space?

Thomas Alascio [00:02:18]:

So so I was a bartender, and I love bartending. I Still, we'll guest bartend. I think it's the greatest job in the world. If I can make the kind of money and make us a recruiter, as a bartender, I'd probably bartend. And and maybe one day, I'll I'll retire and and bartend on the beach somewhere. So I always get customers come in saying, hey. You're gonna come work for us. You know? And, I was like, hey.

Thomas Alascio [00:02:37]:

Get another drink. Yeah. We'll talk about it. Never really took him seriously. Stop brokers, A guy owned a jewelry store, whatever. And then, guys would or a couple that owned a manager's office came in, Said, hey. We're we went to work for us. And I'm like, yeah.

Thomas Alascio [00:02:50]:

Okay. What do you do? We're we're headhunters. And and to like him back to when I was In 1986, I used to work with CBS, and the bosses one of the bosses there, their their husband was a head hunter. And I thought it was so cool. A cool name. And that was the 1st time I ever heard it. You know, I was 17 years old, headhunter. Wow.

Thomas Alascio [00:03:06]:

Never thought about it again until 2, you know, 1997. These people come to my office, and I'm like, They're Mike Barr, and I'm like, yeah. That's that sounds cool. So I went, and, they said stop by the office. Come on by and say, say hi. Came in and say hi And, talked to him, and then I went back for an interview, and they hired me October 13th. Lammas Day was my 1st day of starting, And the rest kinda is history. I mean, it was just just really intriguing to go from bartending to this, but I I Love what I do, and I love bartending, so I had to to make it work.

Thomas Alascio [00:03:40]:

I had to work 9 to 5 or 8 to 5, right, as a headhunter, and then I had to work As a bartender because I had bills and and, you know, a a wife and a kid and everything. So I bartended from 5 until close, which could be 11, 12, 1 o'clock in the morning, Wednesday through Sunday and then headhunted Monday through Friday, 3 months. Right? 3 months. I did that no day off and just pounded the phones, do what I was supposed to do. In my 1st deal with a paint company, division of Sherwin Williams, and my boss came to me and says, hey. You've you figured it out. We'll double your draw, which was minimum wage. And I said, well, Hey.

Thomas Alascio [00:04:15]:

I can't you know, that that might help, but I can't leave my, you know, my old company, my bartending job, you know, high and dry. It was a oceanfront restaurant. It was middle of season, But I'll work weekends, and then once things get slowed down, I'll eventually leave completely. And that's kinda where it went.

Benjamin Mena [00:04:31]:

That's awesome. So were you doing a 360 then, or was it just a 180?

Thomas Alascio [00:04:35]:

In to turn yeah. No. I've never done, you know, 180 Until recently, but it's always 3.60. Right? So every morning you get up, you you you sit in on the phone and make 50 phone calls to Hiring manager with my MPC saying, hi. I just interviewed this great guy. He's a project manager, and he wants to move to Phoenix. When would you like to interview Monday at 4, Tuesday at 3. And then, you know, I did that for a month and a half, right, because I didn't have any job orders to work on.

Thomas Alascio [00:05:01]:

And finally got a couple job orders, and then so my day was split up, You know, in the morning, marketing the MPC, good ones come back, and then the rest of the day was spent recruiting on the jobs that I had. Right? And that and then, you know, you get candidates from jobs. Recruiter one day, you get a new MPC, and, you know, that that desk is a manufacturing plant. Know, you gotta get job orders, and you gotta get candidates. And I did that and slowly but surely grew my desk into what it is now. So In my 1st place, it was a painting guy that the MPC that I was, marketing was a guy named Mike Betavanga from Chicago who was a project manager in commercial roofing and went and moved to Phoenix. Right. So I'm calling every commercial roofing time.

Thomas Alascio [00:05:39]:

I haven't done a deal with a commercial roofing contractor in 20 years. So it was weird how where I started and where I am now. But the initiative I'm in now, which is kinda like engineered products, construction, structural engineering related to manufacturing related to that, I've been in that industry since February of 1998, I made 2 deals with a company and exploded from there. So I've stayed in that same niche, That same industry, that same market since 1998.

Benjamin Mena [00:06:07]:

So, like, taking a step back. So you've got started. You cut your teeth on in an in an MRI franchise. Where'd you

Thomas Alascio [00:06:14]:

go Fully trained. No. I stayed there for 14 years. Mhmm. To help build that up, we did 4 and a half $1,000,000 in billings every for, like, 3 years in a row. We had 16 recruiters. I helped train that you talked about 365, 180. I helped train what we call project coordinators.

Thomas Alascio [00:06:29]:

There was were, junior recruiters that would work underneath of us. I would go out and Get all the business. I work on some of my jobs, and then I also have the junior recruiter recruiting for me. Right? So they would you know, that was a team. We had this team environment. When you had to do $450 on their own before you get your own project coordinator. So we built an office with I think we had 11, Now 10 recruiters all working within the the the the construction divisions. Right? So we had roofing, general contracting concrete, electrical mechanical, And then we had 5 or 6 project coordinators, and we were doing, like, $4,000,000.

Thomas Alascio [00:07:06]:

So as and then the yeah. We had a recession. We made it out of the, the, dot conversation kind of it. Okay. But the the housing recession devastated the office, And the boss went crazy and fired people. And when I left in, April of 2011, I was the last I was the very first employee hired In 1998 or 97, and I was the last employee working there, 2011. So you built it to 16 people and then ran everybody off, and I tried to as long as I could because I had so much invested. I built the ETFs there and a lot of other things.

Benjamin Mena [00:07:42]:

And then

Thomas Alascio [00:07:43]:

Oh, man. And I had I had I had Phantom stock worth, like, $10. It was gonna be worth a lot more when they sold the company back when we were doing $4,000,000 a year. And finally, I've said, you know, I can't do this anymore, and I vaulted. Oh, so it was 60 you know, 14 years, 1997 to 2011, is that 14? That's 40, that I worked for them, and helped build that office.

Benjamin Mena [00:08:05]:

And construction, I actually if if you wanna give off, I my 1st recruiting job was a construction management headhunter in Florida back in 2006. Everything was gangbusters.

Thomas Alascio [00:08:16]:

Oh, good. And then 2 years later,

Benjamin Mena [00:08:19]:

it wasn't even 2 year. I don't even think it was, like, 2 years later. It was just, like, baby was, like, 9 months later. It was just like, I started getting call after call. Like, we just gotta let go. And I'm like, let go. Like, what did you do? What did you do? Were you shoved drunk to the job? Like, They needed just somebody that was breathing, and they're like, it was just, like, call after call. It's just so everybody was getting fired, and it just kinda like, oh, well.

Thomas Alascio [00:08:38]:

Somebody turned off a spit. I mean, project Stopped. It was the craziest thing. Like you said, overnight, we went from gangbusters to every project putting a hold on, and every candidate told you go pound sand, was banging your foot. Well, please please please help me. It was insane. Mike Kittleson is probably who you ran into. He was the Florida recruiter for KBasset International, was doing $2,000,000 a year in Florida As a recruiter, and all he worked was he worked every construction.

Thomas Alascio [00:09:04]:

So he did general contractors all the way down to subcontractors, And but only in the state of Florida. And I remember talking to him at one of the MRIMs going, yeah, dude. We went from 2,000,000 to 500,000. I had to fire 3 recruiters. Yeah. And it was tough year.

Benjamin Mena [00:09:19]:

Luckily, I was able to switch over to aviation and government contracting, but it was just like yeah. I'm sitting there looking at my desk, and, of course, you know, everybody's, like, Looking at my numbers, and I'm just like, I'm making the calls. I'm doing the things that you're telling me to do. Like,

Thomas Alascio [00:09:33]:

I feel bad for some of the guys in IT and tech right now because they feel like, you know, they're same thing's happening, and it's you have to be more selective. And that's what I, you know, I still did 250 ish, 300 in those really bad years, but it was, you know, because I was in the same industry. Right? And I had clients who who knew me, and if they wanted to fill a position quick, they'd call me or, you know, locations that were tough to fill, stuff like that. Right? And and it was a I worked a lot Longer hours and a lot harder to make less money, but I still made a 6 figure income. It was just tough. It was a it was a 2000 innings. 2009 was tough years.

Benjamin Mena [00:10:09]:

Well and I I wanna kinda, like, focus on that for a few minutes. You know? It's 2 2020 was, like, crazy. 2023 is, like, Some industries are it's the recruiting market's absolutely crazy. What lessons did you learn from those Ups and downs during those other 2 recessions that you could give some advice to recruiters now.

Thomas Alascio [00:10:33]:

You know, I I don't wanna be sound like a broken record, but it what it what it comes down to is is going back to the basics. You know, when Tiger Woods was having these struggles, he started back to the basics. Go back and think about what you did in the beginning to be successful and start working towards that. Right? And the other thing is If your niche is and I don't know anything about IT, and I know a lot of people struggle in IT. But if you're in IT, like, where what is an ally Sealed to IT, like, go one over or one over because that's a lot what I right? So I was in you know, my niche was was very narrow at one time, and I started working out towards industries where a person would be able to make a transition from the light gauge steel industry to the joist and deck industry. Right? We're from the joist and deck industry to the tow steel tower industry. Right? So a lot would do with engineers, and and there was a I could see a lot of, you know, across this area Where the, you know, the the training times would be quick. So one industry was doing bad, the other one was doing better.

Thomas Alascio [00:11:32]:

You just move into that That niche. So, you know, when things got tough, I got back on the phone, was making 50 phone calls in the morning, and it didn't matter. Right? So when I started out, I didn't know what I was doing. So make it 50 phone calls a day with a stupid pitch about a guy who's a project manager in Chicago who wanted to move to Phoenix. He wasn't an MPC. They had to relocate him. That's not an MPC, but I still make 50 phone calls a day. And we kinda got stuck into this, well, I'm really good.

Thomas Alascio [00:11:58]:

I shouldn't have to do that. We'll know when it's when the work is tough. Get back on the phone in deep I know you don't want to. I know it's painful, and it hurts that you're gonna make 50 phone calls a day, but do that. You can't get anywhere if you're not talking to people, and you're gonna uncover you know, we we talk about this as a a numbers game until you get the skills, And then it's a skilled game, but you can't use your skills if you don't have the numbers. Right? So it's a balance. You have to say to yourself, you know, I if you're not making 10 phone if you're not making 5 phone calls a day, Lynn, you're not getting business. Right? So, yeah, you don't have to make 50 anymore.

Thomas Alascio [00:12:32]:

Right now, I don't. But if things got tough, I'd be back on the phone, man, calling every single person just Letting them know that I'm there, calling new employers because you're gonna stumble on, oh, yeah. We had this position open for 6 months. We can't find anybody because it's in Norfolk, Nebraska. Well, guess what? I'm gonna go out there and find somebody to move to Norfolk, Nebraska because I wanna eat. And it you know, you're not gonna get the easy fills. You're not gonna get, We're not gonna get full fee. You're gonna pay 25%, or maybe you have to go down to 20.

Thomas Alascio [00:12:58]:

You're not gonna get an agent fees, but you're gonna pay the bills. That's all what it ever came down to is I worked on anything I could in those tough times because I wanted to I needed to make money. I had kids, wife, and everything. So it getting back to those basics. It's Looking at your desk and going, where can I make a placement? There has to there everybody know Yeah. They're not paying fees. Yeah. They're laying people off, but they still are hiring people, and there are still places where they cannot find anyone, and you gotta get your foot in that door.

Thomas Alascio [00:13:27]:

And it's not by sending out a campaign of a 1000 emails. This is a relationship business, and you cannot develop a relationship Without talking to the person on the phone, you can't overcome objections, with rebuttals if you're not on the phone. You can't do that. You can't overcome an objection of we don't we don't pay 50% we don't pay 30% of the email. Right? That's something has to be done on the phone. You're not gonna make a a impact If you're not on the phone, you know, I use the word the term yay or jay or, mad or glad. When I'm on the phone with someone, I want it, and I hang the phone up. I want that person to be happy they were talking to me or mad they were talking to me, I don't want them to be like, meh.

Thomas Alascio [00:14:05]:

Right? I want them to remember me. If I call you back in 10 days and you don't remember who I am, I could say, oh, there's a recruiter because I didn't leave an impact. I didn't leave a an impression on you of who I was. If I hit who's this? Tom Malachi? Who? I'm a head owner. I talked to you. When? I I failed. If I if I do that, I call someone, and that's what they say to me. I know I failed because I didn't make that impact.

Thomas Alascio [00:14:25]:

And you have to make that impact. You have to, You know, get out there and develop that relationship. This is a relationship

Benjamin Mena [00:14:32]:

business. And, you know, I think you've really nailed it on the head of getting back to those fundamentals and back to those basics In tough times, because at the end of the day, like, you know, if you're only making 3 calls and nothing's coming from those 3 calls,

Thomas Alascio [00:14:46]:

It's a numbers game until it's a skills game. With the mutuals game, you still have to have some numbers. And if that's, You know, the you know, I do I still make marketing calls, but very select. Right? Because my industry's strong. We got lots of jobbers to work on, but I still make Marketing calls. I still like I keep my skills, man. I got I gotta keep myself. You know, you work out.

Thomas Alascio [00:15:07]:

Right? You know, I'm a fat ass now, but, you know, if you wanna stay in shape, you gotta work out. You know, you run. You run every day. Right? No. If you don't run, you know, you lose it. Same thing with recruiting. You gotta you gotta you gotta use those skills or you're gonna lose So don't ever I mean, if anybody ever tells you, I have too many jobs to work when I can't get any more business, you're wrong. Maybe it's just 1.

Thomas Alascio [00:15:27]:

It's 1 new job order a month. Gotta keep those skills going.

Benjamin Mena [00:15:31]:

Oh, I absolutely love that. And is there anything else that you've learned through through those ups and downs?

Thomas Alascio [00:15:39]:

It mustn't last forever. And what now? If it doesn't kill you, it makes you stronger. I mean, I like, you know, what's This is my wife will get upset sometimes. Right? Like, we'll we'll, you know, have a bad a bad year. Right? Because when we started out, look, I I got a I had a I had a, a car repossessed. Right? And time's tough. Right? So yeah. But I tell her, we always have a roof over our head.

Thomas Alascio [00:16:00]:

We'll always have food. Right? So, you know, stuff that stuff's always gonna happen, But you're we're not gonna be living under a bridge. Right? We're we're not gonna be you know? Is it it's never gonna be that bad. You Just have to keep focusing and figuring it out. And and if you do what you know, you know you can do. You've done this. I've done this for 26 years. I know I can do this.

Thomas Alascio [00:16:22]:

I know I'll always be able to make placements. I'll be 79 years old in a wheelchair. Right? You don't wanna hammer my like, I can always make placements, And I will I that is something that I 100% believe in. I just keep keep moving forward. I will make placement. I will get a check-in. I will make money. Never have to worry about that.

Thomas Alascio [00:16:40]:

That you just have to have that mindset. There is no failure. There is no failure.

Benjamin Mena [00:16:45]:

And you you said you you got you got your car repossessed. I know one of the times, like, I I don't remember when exactly it was in my agency recruiting days, but, like, my Numbers went downhill, and, you know, I had to go like, things were not the combat. I think I also, like, a lot like, my car broke. I didn't even have a car, so I was taking the bus I do the office every day without anybody knowing. I, like, I don't ever wanna go through those again, but Talk about the resiliency that you've learned during those time

Thomas Alascio [00:17:17]:

periods. The resiliency. I mean, it it's I I I don't know if I can answer that the way you probably want an answer. It's really I mean, I truly believe if I I will Buddy and I, he's a silent partner in the business, Dimitri. We figure stuff out. No matter what, we always figure it out. You just you because there is no other option. Right? You have to look at it like there is no option.

Thomas Alascio [00:17:43]:

I'm not gonna go sell cars. Right? I'm not gonna go work at a school. I make way too much there's no other job I can do that I can make the kind of money that I make that quick. Right? So you oh, we guys well, how about I I will get job because I'm just so things get better. No. This is never gonna be enough. If if If you're gonna take all that energy and focus on learning how to sell cars or learning how to, you know, sell widgets or whatever, go focus out on recruiting because you know it. You know this industry.

Thomas Alascio [00:18:08]:

You know how to do this job. That's the only resilience I can tell you, Ben, is that there there is no failure. There is no giving up. I'm just going to keep making phone calls. And if I have to switch industries completely one day, maybe I will. Right? If they outlaw structural engineering. Right? I'll figure out something else because I I can do this in any industry. I can go into any industry.

Thomas Alascio [00:18:28]:

It may take me a little longer to go into, I don't know, bottle washing, but I'll still figure it out. Love it. We're good

Benjamin Mena [00:18:35]:

at it. There's no plan

Thomas Alascio [00:18:37]:

b. No. I burned that bridge a long time ago. I can never get hurt for another person again. My god. You know? I'm the worst employee in the world now. I should have fired myself a long time ago. Right? So you think somebody's gonna put up with my Domino's? No way.

Thomas Alascio [00:18:53]:

There is no plan b. Hey there.

Benjamin Mena [00:18:56]:

Wait. Well, here's another question for you. Like, what really convinced you to really just go out on your own?

Thomas Alascio [00:19:03]:

So it goes back to, the old firm. Right? So I gave that firm a 110%. Right? I was helped them hire I get I got paid the same as everybody else. You got, 35% of the first $150 to bring in, 40% of the next 50 and then 50% of everything over a 150,000. Didn't matter how long you'd been there, whatever, and there was no raises. There was no extra commissions. There was nothing. We had Pacesetter trips, everybody could win, but it didn't matter to me because I wanted the business to grow.

Thomas Alascio [00:19:31]:

Just like you you hear me giving back, I gave back to all the employees. I mentored people. I was always about, let's get we're gonna we're gonna we're gonna build Pearson to, name a couple of Pearson, to 5,000,000, 6, 7,000,000. So I was in it A 110%. Right? I trained people, did everything to make their company happen. And then when things started going downhill and he went crazy I was firing people and running people off, and I was the last employee left. Well, there was not I all this time invested, and nothing show for it. Nothing whatsoever.

Thomas Alascio [00:20:02]:

So I said, you know what? I'm gonna go so I'm I'm not gonna do this again. I'm not gonna build him up again to have nothing to show for it. So I did not agree agreement. I had to be a 100 miles away, and he tried to say that I Signed a new one when I signed a and when I went to work for them, they were MRI office, and that used to be the non capis were always a 100 miles because Long distance phone calling was a super expensive. And for yous who are listening that are, you know, that are that are 20, we used to pay, like, 10¢ a minute for phone calls. So all the recruit all the management recruiter offices were in big cities, and they only recruited in that city. And then as rates started to drop, They started moving to rural areas like where I was, but we still were paying, like, 5, 6¢ a minute for long distance calls. Like, we get a phone bill and but this this big.

Thomas Alascio [00:20:45]:

My noncompete was based on that old way of life, and I had signed it when I first started in 97. And then as we grew, they changed noncompete into industry specific. I never signed a new one, but I signed my handbook, and he tried to say that I did. So I just said, screw you. I'm sticking with the 100 mile radius, and I have no money in in, in Georgia, right, which is a 100 miles from Bureau. I moved to Virginia and started my own business that way. Because if I was gonna do this, I'll just I did it $16,000 total. That was my half, like, my four zero one k you had already borrowed against to pay bills to Stanford, and that was all the money I had in the world.

Thomas Alascio [00:21:20]:

And I left my wife, Kids and horses and dogs and car payments, like, all the way to Virginia, running an office in Westatte Avenue in Bethesda. Something to floor on my bro ex brother-in-law. He's divorced. My sister, we're still friends on something his floor. And I worked pound to the phones with, Google Sheets, Google, voice, a borrowed laptop. Right? And I made a deal with Kingstamp Panels in 3 weeks for $18,000. At the check-in, I gave him a $1,000 fast paid discount at the check-in in a week, and the rest is history. Ever in it, there were some tough times in there, but, there was no failure.

Thomas Alascio [00:21:54]:

Like, when I went up there on April 1st, there was no failure. I had to make a deal in 30 days because I had my bills were $12,000 a month. I've had to make money. So that's when you say there's no plan b. It was I was up there, and I was making, and I just started Pounding the phones. I actually did a bartending job at night because I was bored. I helped a guy open a a Greek restaurant, and I I did up all his liquor and everything for her because I was bored out of my mind because my kids were home. I work till 6, go bartend for him for 4 hours, and then drive back to my, brother in law's house.

Thomas Alascio [00:22:26]:

So, you know, there was no planning. I I had I and He tried to sue me, sent letters, told one of my best clients, the guy I used to go out to coffee with, that I was cheated on my wife, that I was a drug addict, And I had stole money from him and a bunch of other crap. And, then they sent a letter to every single Well, some of my clients that if they use my services, they would be in contempt of court, and they would be sued. And every single one of my clients, except for 2, shit. What Under this guy and then there's other 2 clients? Within a year, I got them back. I

Benjamin Mena [00:23:02]:

see. Pause. Pause. Pause. Pause. Pause. You built an entire company pretty much. Your you helped somebody build an entire company.

Benjamin Mena [00:23:12]:

You did the training. You did the recruiting. You didn't get paid more for the hope of when it finally cashed out.

Thomas Alascio [00:23:18]:

He said that we would we would be able to buy it from him. Me, Jimmy, and 2 other recruiters, we're gonna buy it from him one day, and he would be around to mentor us. Like, I always looked at it like an engineering firm or a law firm. It's kinda how I wanted to and that's how I wanted to run Clever Rose. That's another story, but That's why I was trying to tell Dave. It was like, we can run this. Paralegals don't make as much as lawyers. Right? Junior partners or junior junior lawyers don't make as much as Partners, why can't we run our firm like this? And it was him and I were bashing his the whole time, but I still wanted to build the business.

Thomas Alascio [00:23:49]:

And you're and then when things went south, I got nothing.

Benjamin Mena [00:23:52]:

You well, you got nothing, but I want like, the the part I wanna focus on is you completely, like, drove to a a Faraway place, you slept on a family member's floor. You, like, rented a small office. You just pounded the phones Until you made the deal, until, like, everything changed and you you got your life back again Mhmm. With your own

Thomas Alascio [00:24:14]:

business. There's no plan b. I I know and I and I've always had confidence in myself that I can make placements no matter what. No matter how bad things get, you can always make placements. And, also, I know this is cliche. Right? But I had this thing on my on my door, and it's it's funny now. Like, you miss a 100% of the shots you never take. Like like Michael Swarton said that or Mankiewicz said that.

Thomas Alascio [00:24:35]:

I ended up with Door before I owned as a bartender. Right? Because I would I would I always I take more chances than you can honestly my pride might went crazy. I will reach for the fence on everything. I take ridiculously huge chances on stuff, Like, leaving my family in Florida, and I was making a $150 working in Peterson. Right? I could've stayed and and had a nice you know, I had benefits and $150,000 easy making that. I left all that behind with $16 total cash I had on me and drove all the way up to Virginia to start this company. That's huge. That's a huge risk.

Thomas Alascio [00:25:08]:

How many people are willing to take that? My my wife has epilepsy and and, diabetes, and she has medications she has to be on. That's Without insurance, that's 1,000 of dollars. I got free kids. Without insurance, that's 1,000 of dollars, but I was not going to do that for someone else again. I wasn't going to build him up again, bring in new people, get up to $4,000,000 and have nothing to show for it. You know, I had to take the chance, and that's what make people won't do. They won't take the

Benjamin Mena [00:25:37]:

chance. And for any recruiters listening, what advice would you give to them When they they're thinking about betting on themselves.

Thomas Alascio [00:25:43]:

You're missing a 100% of the shots you never take, and and if you're young, you don't have any bills, or you're living at home, or maybe you got, You know, you your your total nuts, $4 a month or whatever. What do you have to lose? You got nothing to lose, especially if you're young. If you're a young guy and you're thinking about doing this, you For a young gal, you gotta be politically correct? You have nothing to lose. What's the worst thing that's gonna happen? You you go out and you give it a 110%, It's just not for you when you go back to selling cars or bottle washing or whatever it is. Right? You have nothing to lose. I had everything. Right? I was I'm 30 some years old with 3 kids and a wife and a house and car and all, and we have 3 horses. Like, my daughters are equestrian.

Thomas Alascio [00:26:22]:

I had all that to lose if I didn't make deals. You know how expensive horses are? Good shits of it. Right? I had so if I can do it and I'm dumbass. I grad I didn't Barely graduated high school, did not go to college. I'm not smart, but I didn't give up. Right? I did. And here's another thing too. Fail My way first or fail our way first.

Thomas Alascio [00:26:43]:

I don't you know, if you're getting training, like, we used to say that at management recruiters when I would trade new people, I'd say, look. Earn the right to do things your way and fail our way first. If you follow our trading to the number, you will succeed in spite of yourself, but you have to follow. Yeah. You can't think, this is stupid. This doesn't work. This doesn't make sense. Fail our way first.

Thomas Alascio [00:27:02]:

If you do all the stuff we tell you to do and you fail, Then come and tell us that we're wrong. 99% of people who listen to us and follow the directions and probably and failed our weight first always succeeded. Some were great recruiters. Some only did $200 a year, but, you know, if you do $200,000 working where I worked, you made $80,000. Now that was in 2 in 2001, 2002. That's a lot of money then. Not as much now. Right? But back then, you you know, I always teach.

Thomas Alascio [00:27:28]:

There are a lot easier jobs to do for 60 or $70 a year than this. If you can only make 60 grand and go do something else. Right? This is a job where you should be making a 60 grand account, but fail our way first and earn the right to do things the hard way. And you have nothing to lose. If my dumbass can do it, you can do

Benjamin Mena [00:27:48]:

it. I I cannot wait to cut this up. There's so much good stuff to share in

Thomas Alascio [00:27:52]:

this.

Benjamin Mena [00:27:54]:

So flipping over to, you giving back to the community. I you're huge in giving back. Talk about

Thomas Alascio [00:28:00]:

that. I I want us all to first of all, this is the only industry, the only service that people will do for free in hopes of getting paid down the road. K? No no no company gives, They're booked to 3 accountants and say, whoever gets the accounting done first gets paid. Why are we doing that? Right? So I I'm always Pushing. Get paid for recruiting. Get an engagement fee, 3,000, 5,000. Get paid for the search that you do, and then get paid when you fill the position. Don't expect people to work for free.

Thomas Alascio [00:28:31]:

And the next thing is I want us all to elevate. I there's no competition. We're all in this together. There's more than enough jobs. There's more than enough industries. There's no reason to hide the little secrets if I have them. I want everyone to do better. I and, you know, the quote in my in my email says, Help everyone around you get what they want, and you'll get everything you want.

Thomas Alascio [00:28:53]:

And that's true. If I just help everyone, It'll all come back whether it's you know, I I tell my my daughter this, you know, as a bartender. Hope that she's a bartender now. Runs in the family. Right? I get everything. If you help everyone around you get what they want, you'll never see anyone. That means everyone gets a drink. You get to pick chips.

Thomas Alascio [00:29:10]:

Right? If you're a if you're, a grocer or a grocer. Right? You'll everyone put their stuff in bags and put it in the car. Your boss is gonna be happy. You're gonna get that's all it is. Just help everyone around you get what they want, and you'll get everything you want. And that's how I look at life in my personal, professional, everything. I go on Facebook, Discord, wherever it is, and I somebody asked a question. If I can answer it, I will say this is what I would do.

Thomas Alascio [00:29:33]:

I don't say this is the right way or the wrong way. Some things I will. Right? But most things I'll say, this is what I would do and know how why it works for me. How can I help you get up to that level? What can I do to help you? Because it's it's all about help. We're here for what? Training amount of time. There's a reason to not help each other. And That's the hippie liberals

Benjamin Mena [00:29:53]:

thing. And for for the listeners, like, I would definitely try following Tom on on Facebook. He, like, literally I love when he, like, kinda chimes in, give some advice because it's always on point.

Thomas Alascio [00:30:04]:

I also wanna add. I'm sorry. I didn't mean they were Go ahead. Approachable. I would go to these MRI meetings and these big pillars for coming. Right? Kaye Bassman, Rice Cohen. Right? And give these big but they were never they never felt approachable. I never felt like they'd go up and start talking to them.

Thomas Alascio [00:30:20]:

At Chukawa and you think me? Like, I mean, I'll I I can talk to anybody. They always felt I wanna be approachable. Call me anytime. 772-532-9785. Call me anytime. Send me an email. Connect with me on LinkedIn. Hit me up on Facebook.

Thomas Alascio [00:30:35]:

Join the Discord. Ask to come to the meeting. I'm approachable. I'll answer. If I can't take your call, I'll just say, hey. I can't talk to you. Call I'll call you later. I wanna help everyone.

Thomas Alascio [00:30:43]:

I want us all to elevate, and I wanna be approachable. I don't want anybody to think, oh, you can't call Tommy to snob. That's the last thing I wanna hear. And I want all of us around us, all the other big billers, listen. You're listening to this. Be approachable. Help those around you. That's how we're gonna get better.

Thomas Alascio [00:30:57]:

How we're gonna turn this industry into a trans from a transactional, right below used car dealers Into the same level as lawyers and accounting firms and consulting firms, that's where we should be. We are just as important as their accountants. We are just as important as their attorneys. We provide them human capital, and we should human capital, and we should be recognized as such, but we don't. Too many of us think, oh, I I I need to work on continue no. You are important to the company And act like it and elevate everyone to have that same attitude.

Benjamin Mena [00:31:36]:

Awesome. And for the listeners, Tom also holds a weekly roundtable where it's a lot of big doors, top doors get together. Everybody asks, like, asks questions, answers questions. And that I I'll have a link for that in the show notes so that way you could, like, if you wanna jump in what in a future week.

Thomas Alascio [00:31:55]:

Everyone's welcome. Everyone's welcome. Friday, 12:30 Easter. We just have everything from MPC marketing to engagement fees to AI To, what's new in the industry, your best training manuals, everything. I mean, there is no topics that are off limits recruiting wise. We'll talk about everything, And we'll answer questions or guys who are billing way bigger than me that are on there. There are newbies that are on there. There are dinosaurs like Ernie Moreno in the industry.

Thomas Alascio [00:32:22]:

We're trying to get Guest speakers, we had, Rich Rosen on, to talk about focus. Right? Talking about focus. I'd love to get somebody like Dean DeCosta or, Who's the other guy that does the, s s the SSAR thing? Get him on and and talk about sourcing. Right? Because that's a lot of people always ask about sourcing, so I'd love to get some other you know, you could come on and talk about podcasting. Right? Like, I'm not a big pot you know, like, I guess my YouTube's a podcast now. Right? But I'm not a big podcasting guy. But, you know, you could you know, I I think that's great if someone wants to start a podcast about Their industry or their recruiting too. You know? Those are those are ways to get you out there, ways to get people to look at you and go, I wanna work with that guy because he does this, that, and the other thing.

Benjamin Mena [00:33:08]:

Yeah. No. Definitely be happy to. I I could talk about the tech that you could do that

Thomas Alascio [00:33:11]:

Brian State. Sorry. Brian State. That's good. Like different. If you wanna go

Benjamin Mena [00:33:15]:

if you wanna go laugh, I just got done with an interview with Brian Fink.

Thomas Alascio [00:33:19]:

Great

Benjamin Mena [00:33:19]:

guy. 40 minutes

Thomas Alascio [00:33:21]:

ago. Yeah. I just like, his he's got the c s CSN builder, a custom search engine. I mean and he gets away for free. I mean, just great, Reguy,

Benjamin Mena [00:33:33]:

Ryan. Hey. What what's so cool is, like, you have your your roundtable that you host. He actually has a open door on Fridays. It's like I love that both of you guys just, like, give back to the community like you guys

Thomas Alascio [00:33:44]:

do. Again, we're all trying to elevate one another. Right? That's what it comes down to.

Benjamin Mena [00:33:49]:

So what what if I flip over to, you know, talking about business development? Do you have any business development secrets that can help recruiters out right now?

Thomas Alascio [00:33:57]:

I see. So, you know, we we of of the same was plug in the round table. We just did a really good MPC, business development round table, like, 3 weeks ago. And there's 4 things, and I think I'm I posted 1 on, on Facebook recently, and then I posted all of them in on Reddit. So I I'm a active also on Reddit as well as as, Discord. So MPC marketing is is is is one that we all know, right, like MPC. But I have one I call the. Right? And that is it doesn't work as well if your industry isn't strong.

Thomas Alascio [00:34:30]:

But if you're new, this is a great one in an industry where there's a low unemployment rate construction. Now you wanna go into construction? This is great. Ben, hi. My name is Tom Elantio. You and I, we spoke before. I, just got done a search for 5 z Construction in Chicago, and, we were looking for a project manager. We just filled it. We heard you guys were looking for a product.

Thomas Alascio [00:34:47]:

There's rumors you guys were looking for a project manager. Reason for my call is, wanted to see if that rumor is true, and if it is, help you fill it. Right? And it's a little more nuanced than that, but what you're doing is you've just told you've just brag So you really wanna do without bragging. Right? You've just said, I'm in your industry. I work with a competitor of yours. I just found them a person that you're trying to find, and I did it quick. And I also heard, as I got my ear to the rail, that you're looking for someone. So that guy, instead of, I got this great candidate, right, or I got these leftovers that I wanna charge a full price for, like Trisha said, instead of the wedding.

Thomas Alascio [00:35:25]:

You know? Like, I love that part in her her thing on yours is that you're like, I'm in this industry, and I know what's going on. I wanna help you. And it it it starts to relate. It starts a conversation. And what people don't forget is every time you're on the phone, it's just not about getting a job order or creating a candidate. There's 5, 6, 7 objectives that you can achieve on every phone call. Right? And they tell you, whenever they tell you, you can go to the next thing. If if you can't recruit the candidate, have you heard about any other, jobs out there? Has any other recruiters called you? Right? Does your company pay fees? Does your company use recruiters? Do your company have any openings? Let's connect on LinkedIn.

Thomas Alascio [00:36:04]:

If you call a a potential client and he says, we don't have if I do the assumptive opening, he says he doesn't have the opening, I go, oh, maybe it was a wrong division. One of your other divisions that meet the guy like that. You know? And then he oh, well, maybe. Do you guys state the east? Do you guys use recruiters? Who do I talk to at that division? And what about you? Would you consider making a change? Right? Have you got called by any recruiters lately trying to get you to to leave? What company was that for? Every phone call you make, you can get all that information. And the last thing you should do is connect with them on LinkedIn, and that goes back to my mayor Glenn. When you start doing that stuff, They're gonna remember you because no other recruiter does it. Every other recruiter they'll pitch the candidate, say he's not interested. You'll ask him if you know anybody else.

Thomas Alascio [00:36:44]:

They say no. You'll say, oh, let's connect the LinkedIn, and then you'll Yep. That's it. But if you stay on the phone, try to overcome the objection of I'm I'm I'm happy where I'm at. Well, I didn't call you because you were happy where you're at. If you're unhappy, you call me. I called you because I have an opportunity in your backyard. It's better than the one you have to cut down.

Thomas Alascio [00:37:01]:

You can put more money in your pocket. Assumed you'd want me to tell you about it since it's better than the one you have now. Right? That's that's, you know, that's the quick off the cuff A rebuttal I use whenever someone says to me, I'm happy where I'm at. I didn't call you because I thought you were happy. Or unhappy, you're unhappy, you called me. Just like employer says, we don't have any openings. I didn't call you because I thought you had an opening. I'm calling you because I have a candidate.

Thomas Alascio [00:37:24]:

His head and shoulders better than anybody you have on your team. He's working for a direct competitor. Your number 1 sales guy. He could hit the ground running the day he starts with you. That's at least worth the price of a mission to talk to him. Don't you think? Any smart employer you know, most smart lawyers, if you do have those goods, they're gonna talk to you. And even if they don't, Then you roll into okay. It's fine.

Thomas Alascio [00:37:44]:

I understand, Bill. You don't have any openings. Can't use this guy. Is there any divisions that have any openings? Do you guys use recruiters? How do I get on that list? How about you? You recruit the guy you're talking to. He may wanna move. He may be an FBC. You may have a job order you'll know about. If you all know if you don't ask, ask.

Thomas Alascio [00:38:03]:

Right? Call pick up the phone and call people. If you're disturbed, you can always apologize later. We are in the business bothering people. Right? And we can always apologize. Also, don't ask. How are you today? I used to smack the recruiters in my office back in the head if I hear them say that. Nobody cares how they are. You don't care who they are.

Thomas Alascio [00:38:21]:

I don't care how you are. Right? And every other cold caller does that. What you say is say, Hi, Vince. Tom Balacchio. I know you're busy. I'll be brief. You're respecting their time. I'm a head owner.

Thomas Alascio [00:38:34]:

I specialize in your industry. Blah blah blah blah. But it's I know you're busy. I'll be brief. I don't give a shit how you feel that I you don't care how I feel. But I do respect your time, And I know you're busy, so I will be brief to tell you about this great opportunity or this great candidate or whatever it is. Stop asking people how they are. Respect their time and say, hi, Ben.

Thomas Alascio [00:38:58]:

This is Tom. Last year, we had our Schmidt Forum. I had on our specialized engineering. I know you're busy, Omie Breeze. I recently interviewed a candidate who goes blah blah blah blah. You're gonna get a lot more out of that than every other recruiter that said, Hi, Ben. This is Tom Lastio. How are you today? Can't you see the time where you could talk? Is now a good time? Right? Is that every single recruiter? Tell me it's not.

Thomas Alascio [00:39:18]:

Tell me. Every recruiter says that right? Yep. You would've you gotta be different. Right? I talk I I if I'm on a if I'm on a candidate Oh, he plays rugby. I'm gonna bring up rugby. I'm I play rugby. I'm a hooker. Where do you? Right? Plays football? I'm a Ravenstann.

Thomas Alascio [00:39:34]:

Oh, god. We can't talk? What do you mean? I guess you're a you're a kid's for a reason. I'm gonna kick your butt all the time. They laugh. That's how they remember you. The conversations Has to be have some little bit of a personalness to it. So they don't care how much you know till they know how much you care. Right? Kinda kinda say.

Thomas Alascio [00:39:53]:

Right? So every phone call I get on, I know something about the person I'm talking to, one little thing, and they're so easy to To to laugh about where you went to school versus where I went to school. Right? Or which college team you don't like or which football team or sport. Those are little things you you go on their LinkedIn and tell me when you're making a phone call, you're gonna pull a link up real quick while you're waiting for the phone to ring, and you see that they went to Clemson, and you could tease them about Clemson versus Auburn Or Georgia Tech versus Georgia Bulldogs or or whatever it is. Those are little things that take me past I'm I'm happy where I'm at. Those are the little things that that push me to the next level and always have.

Benjamin Mena [00:40:32]:

So MRI, I think And I never went through an MRI. You know, I was a AeroTech where in beginning of my Twitter.

Thomas Alascio [00:40:39]:

So I'm sorry.

Benjamin Mena [00:40:42]:

When you're talking about building and, like, what you actually make versus what you build Yeah. Every time people talk about that, I'm like, yeah.

Thomas Alascio [00:40:47]:

I know.

Benjamin Mena [00:40:49]:

That's why also I'm not there anymore. But MRI across the board has, like, their training has produced some incredible people. Absolutely. But the problem is not everybody had access to that MRI training. Where can a recruiter Learn about some of these fundamental basics that come off, like, as natural for you. Like, where can they learn about

Thomas Alascio [00:41:15]:

this stuff? Okay. So, Kate, I I I don't wanna give, I'm a shameless plug, guys. No no money is on this, but they they have the foundation to what matters. KBAC, KBIC, has next level exchange training. They used to have a thing called the foundation training system, and it's fantastic. It is the original MRI With their extra stuff added to it, a lot of engage because we were all contingency back in the day. Right? We were never direct recruiting. I didn't learn how to direct recruit.

Thomas Alascio [00:41:44]:

I learned how to alt like, you would call a guy up and go, hey. I got this great job. Do you know anybody that fits it? I respect your experience in the industry. Do you know any guys that fit this? Right? After 3 days doing that, I'm like, this is dumb. I threw it away and direct recruited. I didn't I actually told my boss. I'm like, I'm not answering people who they know. I'm gonna direct recruit them.

Thomas Alascio [00:41:59]:

If they're good, why wouldn't I direct recruit them? That's stupid. Anyway, so they they have the foundations of MRM. I don't but they changed their whole platform. It's a lot more expensive than it used to be, so I don't know what they have now. But, You know, if you're a new recruiter, you you you will willing to invest a couple grand. Look at the next level exchange foundation training, and they have access to all the what they call their video vault. It's all they have they bought all the MRI videos. Bob Marshall's, Your Desk Is A Manufacturing Plant is fantastic.

Thomas Alascio [00:42:29]:

Steve Spencer's the Nevers recruiting is really good. Those are all in the video vault. Right? So you can get access to all of that. The second one is Steve Finkel. He's old. Right? His stuff, if you if you Breakthrough is my favorite book, and and And I still use rebuttals and information from breakthrough to dent. On the phone today, stuff that I learned from Finkel's breakthrough, From Finkel's, videos, he sells all that on his website. He uses terms like Rolodex and File Cabinet.

Thomas Alascio [00:43:00]:

Right? That's how old the stuff is. But the meat and potatoes is there, And you will learn good classical selling skills tied to recruiting. You will learn how to run your debts. There's book more business. There's Of search and recruitment, there's, breakthrough and, like, one other way. Right? And but it's the the meat is there. If you can see through all the old stuff, The rebuttals on how to overcome objections, how to deal with clients, how to set your desktop, how to market, it's all there, and it's all MRI stuff that he just made better packaged ad classical selling skills to it. So those those 2 things right there, and whether it's Next Level Exchange or Finkel, You follow his stuff, you're gonna you're gonna or one one or the other, you will succeed.

Thomas Alascio [00:43:45]:

That that is that is there's no doubt in my mind. Breakthrough's $50. He just did one. It's called breakthrough 2 point o. It's $50. Go buy it. Read it some back to front. The rebuttals alone, You'll be able to use when someone says I'm I'm happy where I'm at, you'll be able to boom, boom, boom, like I do.

Thomas Alascio [00:44:04]:

There's 7 or 8 of them in there. There's, risk reward ratio is one of them. Yeah. What do you got to lose? Yeah. Yeah. You know, type type rebuttals. I can't remember all them up top of the head. But yeah.

Thomas Alascio [00:44:18]:

I mean, that's that that's good. If you can't get the MRI training, that's a good place to start where you can get it. Oh, thank you, Trevor. And and, yeah, core app yeah. Yeah. Figma's great, and and people are gonna say, ah, Figma. 1st in the put, man. It's 26 years, but my worst year, I did 350,000.

Benjamin Mena [00:44:40]:

And it I mean, it goes back to, like, back to the basics.

Thomas Alascio [00:44:44]:

It This was not rocket science, man. Everybody this is not rocket surgery. Right? This is not this is there's no there's no tricks. The basics is what This is and now you can get better and do certain things, but the basics of this job is what it is. There is no tricks to that.

Benjamin Mena [00:45:01]:

So I wanna ask another question, and shifting gears a little bit.

Thomas Alascio [00:45:05]:

Sure. And this is

Benjamin Mena [00:45:06]:

kind of like, you know, maybe a little bit on the personal side. Our industry attracts a lot of people Like myself, I have ADHD. It has been a detriment, but it has also been a super superpower. What advice would you give to other recruiters out there that are dealing with, you know, certain levels of ADHD?

Thomas Alascio [00:45:27]:

So I have severe ADHD. I'm on 60 milligrams of Adderall. When I worked at the MRI office, I didn't know I had ADHD because when I wasn't on the phone, someone snapped me upside the head. I get yelled at, I had a boss. Right? Went off my own. All of a sudden, I'm sleeping in. I'm Looking at boats to buy, you know, and I'm like, oh my gosh. I went to a therapist, but it's harnessing there's a lot of great things about ADHD.

Thomas Alascio [00:45:51]:

Right? We have a ton of energy. We can multitask. Right? Harness that. Use the parts of the ADHD that you know will work, And then get medication or meditation, whatever it is for the stuff that doesn't. Right? The the the the biggest thing is always the weapons of mass distraction. Right? And that is you know, it's but but what I do is I set myself yeah. Exactly. I have what I call Little rewards.

Thomas Alascio [00:46:17]:

Like, we have goals. Right? Your goal is to do 400,000. If you do 400,000, you're gonna buy a new Mercedes. That's a big goal most people would do, or I'm gonna buy a new house or or go on a trip or whatever. Right? Set yourself out daily goals. I make 20 phone calls. I can go out, book a cigarette. I get a send out for that day.

Thomas Alascio [00:46:37]:

I can leave early. Wait. The whole goal is 1 send out a day. You get 1 send out a day. At the average recruiter, new recruiters, send out the place the ratio. We talk about Send out the placement ratio that is first time send out. The placement ratio is 10 to 1. You'll get 10 first time send outs, phone interviews, Face to face interviews, you'll make a placement.

Thomas Alascio [00:46:59]:

So we used to say, send out a day 200 k. Right? Send out a day, It's 2 deals a month, $20,000 fee, $40 in billings, 480,000 on the commission rate, dropped you to 200 and plus in cash. So focus on that. Focus on getting 1 send out a day every single day, and you'll you'll make more deals than you ever thought. My send up, please, ratio is much lower now. Through 3 to 1. Right? I get to speak 1st on send out. I usually make a deal.

Thomas Alascio [00:47:28]:

So I'm not if I did send out a day, right, but I'm lazy, I would do twice as much as I do, but put those goals together for yourself, whether it's 20 phone calls, a send out, a job order. All there's your goals for the week if you got 5 sendouts for the week. Hands on day is Friday. You know, 20 phone calls take a break. That's how you block out phone calls too. For those who say, I can't make 50 phone calls, you can make 10, can't you? Oh, yeah. Then we take a break, They come back and make 10 more. Figure you should find out you'll make 10 and you want, like, 7 real good ones.

Thomas Alascio [00:47:59]:

You'll keep going. You won't take that. Right. There was talk writers. Well, writers write 1 page a day in your book. One page a day, and you'll eventually get through it. But a lot of writers will start 1 page 3, 4, 5, 6. That's the same thing with recruiting.

Thomas Alascio [00:48:13]:

Start small. Block it out. 50 phone calls means 10 phone calls and then take a break. Go do some. Check your email. Go on Facebook. Play with your phone. But set those goals up because if you don't, then the weapons of mass distraction will get to you because you won't You won't focus on what did I do.

Thomas Alascio [00:48:31]:

Right? But if you say, okay. I have 10 ten numbers. Once I get 10, time for a break. Come back, Penn. You know? And go see go see I went to all therapists. I got on Adderall. There's a lot of new drugs out there too that can help. For those who don't wanna take drugs, I completely understand.

Thomas Alascio [00:48:49]:

There's a lot of other things you can do, but the the key to me when I when I Wasn't on the Adderall when I first moved up here and was realizing the ADHD was giving me. That's what I started doing. I started blocking out things and make giving myself little of rewards for the small things to keep my my butt on my in my desk, in my chair, and make the phone calls. And that that is probably the the single biggest advice I could give to anybody is reward yourself for the small things, not just for the $400, What for the 10 phone calls to send out, the placement, the whatever. And and you'll you'll find your days go a lot quicker and are a lot more productive.

Benjamin Mena [00:49:26]:

And that's definitely awesome advice because, like like I said, ADHD could be a bit of a superpower, but there are days where you're just like, scroll, scroll, scroll.

Thomas Alascio [00:49:35]:

Mhmm. And real real quick

Benjamin Mena [00:49:38]:

for the listeners that, don't have the MRI background, what does it send out? Does it send out

Thomas Alascio [00:49:43]:

I Oh. Contract with the

Benjamin Mena [00:49:44]:

client, or is it like a

Thomas Alascio [00:49:45]:

a So so so a lot of little terms. Like, so send out is You've got a job where you're working on, and you've recruited the candidate, and your client's gonna talk to them for the 1st time. That's a send down. Right? So the idea was you make 60 phone calls a day Before lunch, the theater lunch, you're supposed to be getting job orders and getting candidates. Right? And then you're supposed to get you to send out a day, And you had 3 types of job orders. You had search assignments. Those are ones that that you would move heaven and earth to seal. POJO, which means Presentation on existing job order.

Thomas Alascio [00:50:18]:

A POJO job order is kinda like, yeah, and it's out there. Maybe the salary is not right. Maybe it's a relocation. If you get a good candidate, you'll Send them out. And then Kent helps. Those are the ones that you there's no way I can help you, and you but but sometimes can't help can turn into a And opposed to a concern in the search assignment. So you have to balance that. Like, don't get stuck in working on job orders that aren't good job lawyers just because they got job lawyers.

Thomas Alascio [00:50:44]:

Right? Norfolk, Nebraska was talking about that. If you gotta find somebody to move to Norfolk, that's gonna kill you. You know? But if you do get a guy that says, I'll move anywhere, now that Norfolk, Nebraska job order is a POJO. That's that can't help us now at POJO. And it's you know, it says so get those sent out. Get get a job order. Right? You you know, client says, I will pay your fee if you bring me a bottle washer. That's a job order.

Thomas Alascio [00:51:09]:

Right? A standout is finding someone that that client will interview for that job. So that's what you're trying to get every day. You're trying to get a a candidate in front of an employee for the 1st time. We say first time sitting. That's a that's a that's a send out. You know, job orders don't count, in terms of it's all the send out means money. Right? If you get 10 send outs, You'll chances are you're gonna make a placement with the power of 3 too. Three job orders with 3 candidates on all 3 job orders.

Thomas Alascio [00:51:38]:

That's 9 send outs. Right? So if you have 3 job orders and you can get 3 candidates on each job order, the chances you make in a placement are pretty high. So that's the power of 3. We call that. And it gets you 9 send downs. Bring job orders, 3 hit me up. And and, yeah, people are gonna say, oh, I can't even get 1. But I get it.

Thomas Alascio [00:51:56]:

But that's what you should be focusing on. Is is going for that tower 3 and send out a Denny.

Benjamin Mena [00:52:04]:

Awesome advice. Now Now before we move over to the quick fire questions, is there anything else you wanna share?

Thomas Alascio [00:52:11]:

You know, we we went over a lot. I, you know, giving back Where I started getting the industry up and running. You know? Did we talk about, you know, you know, engagements? I don't know if it's something that We can talk about it maybe another time that, you know, when I talk about listing the end of the industry up, you know, get paid to your business. Ask for and you can always ask. Ask for a retainer. Every job order you take, ask for a $3,000 engagement fee. Why am I paying you with $3,000 engagement? Because we are going to scour God's green earth For every candidate in the tri state area that fits his position, we're gonna present you a list of them for you to go over, red line ones you know of, circle ones you think are great, Then we're gonna go out and find them. You're paying us to do the search.

Thomas Alascio [00:52:54]:

And then when we hire someone, you're paying us 25% of the salary minus the $3. I I don't want your $3. $3 can't pay my mortgage. I want you 25,000. Right? And you can always go to contingency if they if you can't sell them on the retainer and engage that fee. I was working on contingency. You can always slip and go, you know what? I see you have some apprehensions. We really want your business.

Thomas Alascio [00:53:16]:

We're gonna do this one in contingency. And you can even say, and but it's gonna cost 30% because it is continuous because all of our engagement clients are 25. So it will save you a little money if you go engagement. Right. You always always do back legitimacy. You can always tell them, we really want your business and go to if you're not gonna get the engagement fee, if you don't ask, Ask every single time you get a job. A client on the phone is willing to give you a job order. Just roll right into oh, by the way, This we'll do this on an engaged basis.

Thomas Alascio [00:53:46]:

I'm sure you wanna do it on an engaged basis because it's you said how important it was. Right? And then engagement. This is what we do. When you go through and tell them how the engaged basis is It's it is. Right? And then they start hipping and hauling. He said, well, they can do it on contingency. But just so you know, you're gonna get when we find a candidate, we're gonna send them to you. You're gonna get the list.

Thomas Alascio [00:54:05]:

And if that candidate's really good, he's gonna go to you and your 3 other competitors because I gotta make money. You're not guaranteeing me a hire. You want you want me to be invested in you and this is a we're we're we're working together. This is a relationship. Right? We're gonna do this together. We're gonna fill your position. I'm you know? Let's do it on engagement. You wanna work contingency? You want a transaction? We can do a transaction.

Thomas Alascio [00:54:25]:

But I know you don't want your the people you sell your stuff to to be a transaction. Why do you want me to be a transaction? I have I have rebuttal for all that. That's why I bring up the accountant. You put you have 3 accountants? Why would you give up to 3 recruiters? You got 3 accountants? Right? So ask ask to help the new recruiters out there, old recruiters, ask for the engagements thing. You have nothing to lose. You can always work it on contingency. You're not gonna lose the job order because you said you're willing. Engage a fee.

Thomas Alascio [00:54:52]:

You just flip it and say, I really want your business for this one time. We'll do it on contingency. But they may say to you, hey. Oh, of course. We we always work in games and videos. Where do we send a check? What did you tell me? Tell me. Ben, your job. What do you got to lose for saying, I wanna work it on engagement fee? And they say no.

Thomas Alascio [00:55:13]:

Okay. I'll write it in. It's that simple. But people aren't asking. People aren't afraid. Don't be afraid. That's another thing. When you call someone on the phone, they're only gonna say a couple things.

Thomas Alascio [00:55:28]:

I'm not interested, happy where I'm at, or if it's a client, we don't pay fees. We don't have recruit. They're not gonna say I want pepperoni on my pizza. So what are you gonna say back to them? Be prepared, and don't be afraid. That's the man are glad. I love messing with people. When someone says we don't use recruiters. Oh, that's awesome.

Thomas Alascio [00:55:47]:

Like, what? I need sources. Dude, if you don't if you don't use a curse, I know how you wanna get people from. I'm writing you right down. This company is not used for. I appreciate that, man. You're making my life easy. And what it comes down to, Ben, is there there are 2 types of companies out there. There are clients and there are sources, and that's it.

Thomas Alascio [00:56:05]:

There are no friends. There are no buddies. There are no there are clients and sources, and that's it. Either a client or you're a source. When you tell me you don't ever pay fees and you don't recruiters, You're a source. I would tell you that, and that guy's gonna be mad at me just to remember who I am. Just like the guy who remembers me when I pull up the stuff about the football. That's the man to go ahead.

Thomas Alascio [00:56:23]:

And you could do that on the phone. That helps you deal with the negativity. You can make an employer pissed, some asshole After you get hung up all 4 times to get that guy screaming and yelling at you and he's 500 miles away, it makes me feel I love my book. That's what you need to do. Those are the rewards I'm talking about. Right? Little things like that make this job so much better. You're in control. It's it's you.

Thomas Alascio [00:56:47]:

This is yours. This is your domain. You're the king. They don't wanna use recruiters. Guess what? You're a source now, buddy. Yep. So that that that's probably the only thing I wanted I forgot about that, and that's something I tell people all the time. You know? Don't take crap from anybody.

Thomas Alascio [00:57:02]:

Don't. Don't work on 10% job orders. Don't take crap. All asked for an answer. A no is better than nothing. Don't go like this.

Benjamin Mena [00:57:16]:

Maybe

Thomas Alascio [00:57:16]:

it'll happen. Kill the deal. Ask the questions. Get an answer. Will you pay my fee? Will you hire this guy? I don't wanna hear we need to see more people. Either it's good now or he's Push for that. Get I know is better than not knowing. I know you don't wanna hear that.

Thomas Alascio [00:57:35]:

I know you wanna say, oh, well, if I just do this, it might go together. No. You can't destroy a deal. There's nothing you can say to make a guy take a job or turn down a job If they're going to take it, there's nothing you can do to an employer, maybe, that he won't hire a candidate if he's the right guy. You can't control this. People are weird. We make we say stuff and do stuff. We lie.

Thomas Alascio [00:58:00]:

We change our mind. You can't control that, So get the answer now. Don't be wishing, is that deal gonna go together on Monday? Find out on Friday. Call that employer and go, are you gonna look, man. This is going on long enough. Are you gonna hire Steve or not? Well, we got 3 other guys interviewed, and we don't wanna tell you about. Now you know. Don't be afraid to get the answers you don't wanna hear.

Thomas Alascio [00:58:22]:

It'll make your life a lot better. A whole hell of a lot

Benjamin Mena [00:58:25]:

better. Man, So much action. Otherwise. I love that. I absolutely love this. So quick fire questions. Okay. What advice would you give to a brand new recruiter that's Just now starting off in our industry.

Thomas Alascio [00:58:38]:

Call anyone and ask for help. Anyone, everyone. Yeah. We're we're here to help you. Listen to your training. If you're a new recruiter, you start a company, fail our way first. I said it before. Listen to what your trainer says.

Thomas Alascio [00:58:49]:

Do what he says, and you will succeed. I know college agree. I'm a surf bum. I listened to what they said, and I succeeded. If I can

Benjamin Mena [00:58:56]:

do it, you can

Thomas Alascio [00:58:56]:

do it. So another thing for new guys. You ever go to a restaurant and get a new waitress? She says, I'm new. You give her you cut her all the slack in the world. You can do that on the phone. You call up a candidate and you say, hey. I'm a headhunter, blah blah blah. And I and you have your pitch and go, I just started.

Thomas Alascio [00:59:11]:

This is my 4th week. Here's here's what they told me to say. Here's my pitch. You know, it's company's, you know, a sports four hundred company with, You know, 17 locations, blah blah blah. The cat when you say I'm new, I just started they're gonna do the same thing they did with the waitress. They're gonna cut you some slack. Don't be afraid to say I'm new. I just started.

Thomas Alascio [00:59:31]:

This is my 4th month in the business. There's nothing wrong with that. People have empathy. You for we forget that. People, you know, as long as you're not an asshole and you are nice on the phone and you do the pitch, just say, hey. I've only been doing this a few months here. I'm gonna read you what they told me to say. So that way you don't come off sounding like a robot, or you think that you you sound too you don't sound natural enough.

Thomas Alascio [00:59:53]:

Now you have an excuse. You just told them why you don't sound natural enough. Use that same thing we use for when you, go out to dinner and the waitress says, yeah, I knew I knew a girl's waitress. Was over a year. She kept saying that every time she go to hell, I just started. Right? Everybody give her a break, and you get a big tip. So don't be afraid to use that.

Benjamin Mena [01:00:10]:

What is your favorite beach to surf at?

Thomas Alascio [01:00:13]:

Favorite beach? If I could surf anywhere, coaster well, it would be Costa Rica, Nicaragua. Popo Agua is really good. Breaks pretty consistent, and then I'm a goofy foot, so probably Nassara anywhere in Nassara, any of the beach breaks. Nassara, I'm old now. I don't wanna surf anything big. My must be take take into Skeleton Bay, which is a huge long last in, Australia that breaks the super cold water. And pipeline, I can't handle them. I'm fat and old now.

Thomas Alascio [01:00:38]:

Though most likely Nicaragua could swarm 89 degrees, head high, a little overhead, mellow, like, and pull into Well, barrel and have a good time. So probably, Popoya and Nicaragua. Head off.

Benjamin Mena [01:00:51]:

Went to high school in Cocoa Beach, so surfing was part of our The community.

Thomas Alascio [01:00:54]:

Hey. The smash in like, years off. I surf monster bowl with 20 foot during per hurricane as well. So

Intro [01:00:59]:

yeah. Oh, man.

Benjamin Mena [01:00:59]:

Her hurricanes were the best. Yep. Back to recruiting. What advice would you give to a recruiter that's been in the industry for a while, 5, 10, 20 years plus, that wants to keep on being successful or become successful.

Thomas Alascio [01:01:13]:

Go back to those basics. If you're struggling, get back to those basics. Again, don't it afraid to ask for help. There's nothing wrong with saying you're struggling And asking for help. We're all here to help each other, and I I know that sounds redundant. I've said it a couple times. I don't care how long you've been doing this. Call me up and hey, Tom.

Thomas Alascio [01:01:27]:

I've been doing this 20 years. I'm struggling. Help me. What can I do? Don't be afraid to ask for help and get back to the bases. Do what Tiger Woods did and say, okay. I started like this. This is how I'm gonna do it. And don't get Too big of an ego that I can't make 50 phone calls.

Thomas Alascio [01:01:40]:

No. You can. And I know you don't want to, but to get back to those basics, you have to. To elevate yourself, it's ask a retainer. Right? If you're a working contingency, ask for engagement fee. Ask for an exclusive. Get whenever some client wants to take something from you, get something in return. We only pay 20%.

Thomas Alascio [01:01:58]:

Well, you gotta pay for the day the guy starts. Right? Get something in return. Don't give it away. Always ask for something in return, and usually, they'll give it to you.

Benjamin Mena [01:02:09]:

What is a book that has had a huge impact on your career? Breakthrough. Stephen. Breaks it. I

Thomas Alascio [01:02:15]:

mean, it it hands down, the best book, for that has the the the most dramatic impact on my career day. It's been that book. Breakthrough by Steve Finn. If it was not for that book, I don't know if I'd be at the level I was at just because so much I learned from it. A 100%, that book.

Benjamin Mena [01:02:35]:

Awesome. What's your thoughts on, artificial intelligence in the future of recruiting?

Thomas Alascio [01:02:39]:

Absolutely fantastic, but it's not gonna replace us. Just like monster didn't, just like career builder did it. Don't be afraid of it. Most people don't even know what it is. My wife knows of it because I use it, but I think, like, 60 of the population guessing what chat GPT is. They have no clue. So don't be afraid of it, embrace it, and use it. Get early on.

Thomas Alascio [01:02:54]:

If you got into monster or group data early on, you made huge money in fees. I use today to write job orders, right, or or write, job descriptions. A company give me a crappy job description, enhance this for me. Right? Or I'll I'll I'll I'll help them enhance it. Makes me seem like a rock star. So embrace it. Don't worry. It's not gonna replace you.

Thomas Alascio [01:03:14]:

Don't even worry about that. If if Monster CareerBuilder didn't replace this, AI ain't gonna replace this.

Benjamin Mena [01:03:21]:

Do you have a favorite tech tool that you use?

Thomas Alascio [01:03:25]:

So I I go I I I've watched your podcast. I know you asked this, and Trish Tampkins, One tab, Stanatanas. Right? And, of course, I can't copy that. So 2, AppSumo. If anybody doesn't know what AppSumo is, AppSumo is A clear and at Clearing House, a place where new developers bring stuff. Right? And you get lifetime deals, 59, 69, 79, $89 for stuff that And we'll end up becoming really good and paying 2 or $300 a month for. Right? So Uptix, which is a really good email campaign tool, was one AppSumo for $79, and now it's $2 and $300 for it a a month. And $79 lifetime item, so did I.

Thomas Alascio [01:04:06]:

Right? So set aside $100 every month. If there and you have 2 months, a 100% money back guarantee if you don't like it. What I do is I invest in them. I I think it's gonna be good. Like, Cladora. I just bought Cladora. I think it's gonna be good. I spent I spent 69 to $59 on it.

Thomas Alascio [01:04:22]:

I get 2,000 lookups for phone Numbers, I use it. I let people try it out. I'm gonna I'm gonna invest in it thinking it'll do what Uptics did. I did the same thing with ClickReach And the same thing with use Artemis. Use Artemis gave me 7,000 contacts. Lookups. Right? So those are 3 that I have right now. So AppSumo will allow you to try stuff out, get you 2 months, money back guarantee, and invest in those things.

Thomas Alascio [01:04:45]:

What's $59? Right? That's just Friday night bar tab. So stay home that night and buy an AppSumo app we think is gonna be good and keep it. So just that one, and the other one was, Brian Finks CSC. That is a must have for everybody.

Benjamin Mena [01:04:59]:

So I I actually if you wanna get laugh, I I'm an absolute junkie. I probably should return more things, but That is When you when you when you buy that thing and you use it constantly and you don't have to pay the monthly fee, it is the most amazing thing in the world.

Thomas Alascio [01:05:15]:

Yeah. I it is you're look you're like I save so much money, like, with use Artemis. Right? Because I use it, and it it's 2 it's $79 a month now. And it's hold on one second. What? Oh, It's $79 a month now. It's the. And I got it for 69 or 59. Lifetime, I get 7,000 credit each month.

Thomas Alascio [01:05:39]:

And they have a they have a late they just added a LinkedIn thing to it. LinkedIn, 20 free LinkedIn, campaign. I don't know. I've I I don't do campaigns, but yeah. So you just absolutely wanna love it. Love it.

Benjamin Mena [01:05:50]:

There's there's one that I just picked up that I'm gonna play with this weekend called voodoo leads, which uses AI. Like, you cut a video, and then it uses a little bit of artificial intelligence

Thomas Alascio [01:06:00]:

I saw that.

Benjamin Mena [01:06:01]:

To to customize it. And I think it's by the founders of the email tool instantly, so it integrates in there.

Thomas Alascio [01:06:06]:

Oh, wow. Did you see jelly jelly reach? Jelly something?

Benjamin Mena [01:06:10]:

I missed that one. No.

Thomas Alascio [01:06:10]:

I didn't miss that one. Check it. It's just it's up still, and it's similar to Cladora and Muse Artemis. Right? So I I'm I'm contemplate I'm like, what am I gonna do with 10,000 lookups? Right? So

Benjamin Mena [01:06:24]:

Awesome. Look. So over to, your own personal success, has there been anything that you can look back and say, like, this has contributed your own personal success.

Thomas Alascio [01:06:36]:

Beside like, my my wife, obviously, putting up with all the crap that I do and taking the huge risks Leaving for 3 months to start the business and all that. You know, that's number 1. And then I got the other thing would probably be, There was a quote. I don't know who said it. If you were the if you were the number 1 at whatever you do, you'll never have to worry about money. Right? You're the number 1 bartender. You'll never number 1 recruit. Doesn't matter.

Thomas Alascio [01:07:01]:

If you just try to be number 1 or whatever you do, you'll never have to worry about money. So I follow that, And then, the the cliche I was saying. Right? To, miss a 100% of shots you never take. If I didn't Take those chances. I wouldn't be successful today. Right? And and it is scary. Right? Overall, we go to school. We're not taught to be entrepreneurs.

Thomas Alascio [01:07:21]:

We're not taught to start our own businesses. We're taught to be employees. So taking those chances and and when I left that restaurant I was working at, I had the best beverage manager. I ordered the wine. And I got to do online trips. I was the beverage manager and the bartender of a multimillion dollar oceanfront restaurant in Durobeach, Florida. When I quit, him I was gonna do with headhunter. They were you were you were you were

Benjamin Mena [01:07:41]:

you were you were you

Thomas Alascio [01:07:41]:

were you were you were you were you were you were you were you were you were you were you

Benjamin Mena [01:07:46]:

were you were you were you were you were you

Thomas Alascio [01:07:46]:

were you were you were And I no. I want more. Oh, we go be a manager here one day. Yep. I'll never be an owner. Right? So it's, you know, those type of things that that, I guess I I could truly might says bottling, you know, be the best of what I can be the number 1. I am the number 1 I am the number 1 recruiter in my niche. In my little niche here, I there's nobody who's as good as me in my niche, and I take every shot.

Thomas Alascio [01:08:14]:

Every shot. 100%.

Benjamin Mena [01:08:17]:

Awesome. And this is my favorite question. Everything that you've gone through, the lessons you've learned, the ups and the downs, The the down downs and the up ups, if you could go back and sit down with yourself at the very beginning of your career, Have some coffee with yourself. What advice would you give yourself?

Thomas Alascio [01:08:37]:

Honestly, the noncompete is not that big a deal. Leave earlier. Besides that, man, I've had a great life. I've lived like a rock star. Right? Maybe stupid stuff like don't buy that boat For $40,000. Right? Stupid stuff late. But no. No.

Thomas Alascio [01:08:51]:

Nothing. This is a great job. I've made a lot of money. I've had a blast. I don't work long hours. I get to see my kids. It is fantastic. The only thing I would have I would say, hey.

Thomas Alascio [01:09:02]:

If I could sit down myself right before I went to work for MRI, Leave in 3 years. Once you've got this figured out, don't worry about that noncompete. Go off on your own. That would be the only thing. Other than that, no. I've I've jumped off mountains in Hawaii. I'm kidding. I I jumped off a waterfall in Hawaii.

Thomas Alascio [01:09:18]:

I've laid on a hammock with my wife snuggling watching whales jump. Right? I've been into casinos of huge places in the Bahamas. I stayed at the Grand Valet, one of the nicest hotels in the United States. It's all because I'm a recruiter. So, no, let's I wouldn't change

Benjamin Mena [01:09:34]:

anything. Awesome. No. This has been a phenomenal one for you. It before I let you go, is there anything else that you'd love to share with the listeners?

Thomas Alascio [01:09:42]:

Again, my phone number, 772-532-9785. Connect me on LinkedIn. I'll accept your connection. Come on Facebook. Join the groups. Our Discord is called headhunters and recruiters Discord. Come to the roundtable. Come on to Reddit, the recruiting, and make it better because there's a lot of Crappy people in there.

Thomas Alascio [01:09:59]:

I'd love to see their their recruiting ready to get better. You know? We're all in this together, and I'm there I'm there to help. I'm there to lift up, and you can Reach out to me anytime. I can take your call. I will. And if you connect with me on LinkedIn or Facebook, I will accept your connection, if you're a recruiter. No sales guys. I don't want any I don't wanna borrow money.

Thomas Alascio [01:10:16]:

I don't need a a business loan. I don't need my phone cleaned. I don't you know?

Benjamin Mena [01:10:23]:

We all get those. Well, man, this has been awesome. I I I cannot wait for this, podcast to go live.

Thomas Alascio [01:10:29]:

I I really thank you very, very much for, inviting me on. I I really appreciate it. I'm honored, you know, to be to be on here, and I think it's, it's fantastic what you're doing to the industry and giving back and allowing our industry to hear from some of the greats In our industry, you've you've you've interviewed some huge billers guys that I've known, ex MRI guys, and you're really doing a great job of of Giving back, Tricia Tampkins, I'm recommend that. I've fantastic all the time. She she brought stuff. She made me remember stuff I forgot. So, yeah, I I really appreciate you having me on. I really appreciate what you're doing for our

Benjamin Mena [01:11:06]:

industry. Awesome. Well, man, can't wait can't wait to share this. And, honestly, for the listeners, Keep crushing it, guys.

Intro [01:11:12]:

Thanks for listening to this episode of the elite recruiter podcast with Benjamin Menna. If you enjoyed, hit subscribe and leave

Thomas Alascio [01:11:23]:

a rating.