The Power of Community in Recruiting with Krista Tan

Intro [00:00:00]:
Welcome to the elite recruiter podcast with your host, Benjamin Menna, where we focus on what it takes to win in the recruiting game. We cover it all from sales, marketing, mindset, money, leadership, and placements.

Benjamin Mena [00:00:19]:
Before we get started, a few announcements. First of all, the recruiting growth summit is live. It's gonna be at the very beginning of March. We already have some Epic speakers lined up. Excited for you guys to learn from some of the best in the industry. And secondly, the book of the month is Atomic Habits. And we do have a get together to talk about it at the end of the month. That link is in the community, so feel free to join the community.

Benjamin Mena [00:00:44]:
But excited for the both of those and excited for man, there are some awesome speakers coming to this recruiting recruiting growth summits. And some of these speakers have personally helped me change my recruiting business, so I'm excited that they're gonna share with you guys. I am excited about this episode of the elite recruiter podcast. I have my special guest, Krista Tan, who is the cofounder of the Talent Collective. And why this is an important podcast is because it's gonna be about community and the impact of a recruiting community that, like, have on your career. And I'm not gonna lie. Like, finding a recruiting community mid level in my career has made the difference In our company, in our family, in my career actually, if you wanna get off about finding a good recruiting community has probably put additional few $100,000 and do back into our business. So we're gonna talk about why it is so important to find the right community So that way that you that they can help you grow.

Benjamin Mena [00:01:47]:
And on top of that, there's like this really cool thing called fractional recruiting. It's a awesome way to bolt on some additional revenue to your business, especially in these times where things are just a little crazy. So Chris is definitely gonna do a little bit of a deep dive on that too, so definitely Stay tuned so you can learn how to you can add that on top of your business. But, Krista, welcome to the podcast.

Krista Tan [00:02:07]:
Thank you, Benjamin. Thanks for having me. I'm super excited To be here, big fan of your podcast.

Benjamin Mena [00:02:13]:
We'd like to have fun, but, I'm sure, as you know, we get started. How did you even end up in this wonderful world of recruiting?

Krista Tan [00:02:21]:
Yeah. So I think I'm one of the the few that had a more Tensional route into recruiting. So went to grad school for a master's in counseling. My specialization was in career development. My main goal going into that program was to be a career counselor at a university. However, midway through My program, I was interning at a college, San Diego State to be exact, and really realized that the pace wasn't exactly for me. I really loved the interaction with the students. That was, like, the heart of what I wanted to do, Helping people with their careers, but I realized I needed something a little bit, you know, quicker, and Corporate was probably for me.

Krista Tan [00:03:08]:
So right after grad school, I moved to San Francisco, and I wanted to get into recruiting. My, like, My dream job would have been to be working at Google in university recruiting because I still had this, you know, passion for college students. However, it was 2008, which was the last recession we were in, and nobody was hiring, especially for recruiters. So out of What I think was desperation at the time to pay my bills, I took a job in agency recruiting, and it honestly ended up being the best thing that Could have happened to me, and I landed at the right agency. I ended up being there for over 13 years, Started, you know, as an individual contributor, worked a desk for 6 or 7 years, and then went into the management and operation side. And pretty much by the end of my tenure there, I was running the company. So it was an amazing journey. I could not be more thankful for working there, and, then I went in house, but, essentially, that's that's how I got my my start.

Benjamin Mena [00:04:12]:
So you actually were looking for a recruiting job. That is out there. Like, very few people actually say that, so that's exciting. And if you want a good Good laugh. My wife was actually a career counselor for a university down in Florida. So when we when I met her.

Krista Tan [00:04:26]:
Okay. Good to know. Yeah. My inspiration was my career counselor. Her name is Emily at the college I was at, the undergrad, and I was like, I wanna do what you do. It sounds so fun, and so I still keep in touch with her to this day.

Benjamin Mena [00:04:39]:
That's awesome. And you went from a, Like, agency desk recruiter to running the company. Can you talk about that real quick?

Krista Tan [00:04:47]:
Yeah. Absolutely. So it was a 13 year process. Very early on, it was a small company. I think we had maybe 13 to 17 employees when I first started. So I was always on the temporary side of the business, which in the beginning was a very small subset subsection of the business. However, I actually am really thankful I started in a down economy because that's like, I learned How hard it was to get a job order and how hard you were had to work to do that in a down economy, and it was also very sad at the time. I mean, Canada's just coming in, like, Crying at your desk, it was, like, the most sad thing ever, but that was, like, the hardest I ever had to work.

Krista Tan [00:05:27]:
And so then it just got easier, like, on the upswing, like, 2010, 11, 12, like, business was just rolling in. It was like all those seeds we had planted for, you know, doing BD early on were just, you know, Coming back to us, it was like the snowball effect. So my division did very, very well. We grew to we were a team of 2 when I first started, Grew to a team of, I think, 10 by the time I came off my desk, and so I, you know, being the most senior person there, was The leader of that division. So I was, you know, player coach throughout probably the second half of that. Became very close with my CEO, gained a lot of her trust. You know, we were joined at the hip and started to talk strategy a lot in our in my one on ones with her. So right before I had my 1st baby, she had a conversation with me about when you come back from maternity leave, I want you to leave your desk forever and come join us on the other side.

Krista Tan [00:06:24]:
And I have to say, I was kicking and screaming. I did not want to Leave My Desk, I mean, it brought me so much joy. I loved working with clients and candidates and, you know, really making those matches and, like, You know, just having that joy of recruiting, the the fulfillment it brought to me. However, I saw the greater picture. The Company was growing like crazy. It was a wild time, and I knew in order to continue growing, we needed A better backbone of the company and that I could help with that. So when I came back from my 1st maternity leave, went into, you know, that side of the business, and then just Continued to grow with the company and really helped build it out from, like it felt like a even though it was a 10 year company when I started, 10 year old company is started like a scrap or felt like a start a start up scrappy start up. But by the time I left, it was very well established.

Krista Tan [00:07:18]:
We had Policy procedure, like all the things. So very proud to have been a part of, like, building all of that out.

Benjamin Mena [00:07:24]:
That's awesome. You've probably learned a lot of lessons along the way.

Krista Tan [00:07:27]:
Oh, yes. Definitely.

Benjamin Mena [00:07:29]:
So going into communities, and I know that, like, the Talent Collective is a community that that you cofounder that you're building.

Krista Tan [00:07:36]:
Mhmm.

Benjamin Mena [00:07:37]:
How before we dive into that, how has has recruiting communities impacted your own personal career growth?

Krista Tan [00:07:44]:
Absolutely. Yeah. And I'll actually, you know, take it back to my days at Premier, which was the agency I was at. I mean, I I moved to San Francisco without any. I had 1 small group of friends, but really dove into my career, and those People became my friends. Like, you know, being in the thick of it every day in the office with them grinding, and then it's like, oh my gosh. We need to go have a drink or, like, Oh my you know, so, like, all of the trials and tribulations that you go through in agency recruiting and just being so tight with those people, You know, I think it was twofold. It was really like I learned everything I knew from the more senior people, my CEO, my COO.

Krista Tan [00:08:30]:
So it was, like, that learning that I got from the community and that, like, encouragement that, like, okay. You're on the right track. You're doing the right things. You know, those tips and tricks that you would otherwise not learn on your own about how to do run this business effectively and how to build relationships, But then also, like, that I think it was, like, that psychological safety that I built this team where, like, We just knew each other so well and could all be our complete selves and just laugh at the end of the day when, like, The shit had hit the fan and, like, everything went to hell, but, like, we still had a, you know, a good sense of humor about it at the end of the day. So That community was really my rock and just gave me such a firm foundation in my recurring in my career in recruiting.

Benjamin Mena [00:09:21]:
And it's it's kinda crazy. It's you know, the the people that have had on the podcast, whether they've realized it or not, they they they fell into a community that has really helped them grow.

Krista Tan [00:09:32]:
Yes.

Benjamin Mena [00:09:33]:
And, like, recruiting very much seems like a a lone wolf business. It seems like a competitive business where everybody's your your competitor, but when it comes down at the end of the day, like Like, technically, we could be competitors, but we're also, like, growing together, and that's what I've seen in the communities that I've run across.

Krista Tan [00:09:53]:
Yeah. So I was Talk about the how we called

Benjamin Mena [00:09:55]:
you real quick.

Krista Tan [00:09:55]:
Oh, sorry. Go ahead.

Benjamin Mena [00:09:56]:
Oh, go ahead. No. Go ahead.

Krista Tan [00:09:58]:
I was gonna say I was really thankful that the Team I was on specifically, we didn't have that competition. And I think one of the reasons is we had a group compensation plan. And so it was like, If we're all good together, we're all gonna grow, and so we really built this, like, cohesion where we didn't have to have that competition with each other. So I'm just so thankful for all of that.

Benjamin Mena [00:10:22]:
As somebody was smart with that comp plan, holy crap. So talk about the Talent Collective. What is a Talent Collective?

Krista Tan [00:10:28]:
Yeah. So Talent Collective is a group of women and those who identify as women who come together For a couple of different purposes, one of which being professional development, keeping cutting edge in Growth opportunities and what's happening in recruiting in the TA profession, you know, helping elevate each other's careers, But then also the community aspects. It's a place where women can come together and really build strong relationships and not just network for networking's sake, but really network for the reason of, like, actually connecting with people and building those deeper relationships. We launched in June in the Bay Area, and we quickly realized that there There was a need all over the US and now even globally, women reaching out to us from everywhere saying, we wanna be a part of this. So when we first launched, we basically had 3 offerings. One workshop a month, we had peer groups, And we have 1 in person happy hour in the Bay Area per month, and very quickly scaled that because we realized we can do so much and we want to do so much for the community. So, by now, we have Play 4 or 5 times the programming of that. We scaled to about 225 or so members, Internationally, now at this point, and we're just getting started.

Krista Tan [00:11:59]:
So very excited to continue this journey.

Benjamin Mena [00:12:02]:
And so and I'm I'll ask this question again at the end of the podcast. Like, how can somebody join the Talent Collective?

Krista Tan [00:12:09]:
Yeah. Absolutely. So You can go to our website. So it's www.talentcollective.community. We have our membership Structure right there on the platform. We have, once you join, you can get access to our circle community platform, which also has just a wealth of other information. We have, like, a toolbox where people put, like, templates and just all sorts of things you may aid in your day to day as a recruiter. We have, like, a partner's page where you can get discounts on certain, you know, companies that we we partner with, service providers to TA.

Krista Tan [00:12:45]:
But, yeah, you can just go straight to our website. We also have a LinkedIn page, so just search for Talent Collective, and you can find more information that way.

Benjamin Mena [00:12:52]:
Okay. Question.

Krista Tan [00:12:53]:
Yes.

Benjamin Mena [00:12:54]:
Why is it also only women? Why can't, like, us guys be there?

Krista Tan [00:12:58]:
Yeah. Yes. I know FOMO. Right? We went back and forth quite a bit when we were founding the Talent Collective on whether or not to include men. We love men. We have so many amazing men, friends, and colleagues in the business, but at the end of the day, and we're actually very happy we made this decision, We decided to just go with women for a few reasons. So first and foremost is, you know, if you look around at the recruiting landscape, A majority of the people in TA are women. However, if you look at the top, oh, there's a lot of men at the top.

Krista Tan [00:13:38]:
And if you look around, like, even, like, podcast show hosts, right, like, ton of men podcast show hosts or Tournament speakers out there that are, you know, it like, kinda at the top of, like, the leading edge of TA, but there's not as many women. And so we really wanted to Advocate for women and help build them up and empower them in their careers. And then secondly, I would say, you know, going back to that safe space, that vulnerability, I think women have a very different experience in the workplace, than men do and even Personally. Right? Like, there's a lot of things personally that women go through, that men don't necessarily go through and vice versa. Right? Like, I I can't say I've been in the shoes of a man or even know what you go through. Right? But we wanted to provide, you know, that safe base for women to be able to connect with each other and be vulnerable with each other. I'll give you the perfect example of why I'm really happy we did so. It actually happened in our launch event in back in June.

Krista Tan [00:14:38]:
We had a fireside chat. We had 4 or 5 amazing speakers, leaders in the TA community and, you know, as a q and a style at the very end, one of the, Members did a question or asked a question to the panelist. You know, what do you think is, like, the one thing that you regret in your career you wish you would have done Sooner. And, actually, I don't think she said career. She just said in your life. And immediately, one of the panelists shot of her hand, and she said, I would have gotten my divorce sooner. And it was this moment where it was like she was being so vulnerable and so personal, and, like, that wasn't the panel was about, but she was being so real and authentic. And, like, everyone loved it.

Krista Tan [00:15:21]:
Like, you know, it was like because she was just Being so real, like, I'm sure that created so many connections afterwards and, like, you know, it was one of those things where it's like, if there was a room full of men and women, she wouldn't have felt comfortable saying that. But but I think just having just women there, there's a different vibe, and so, really, that's what we're going for.

Benjamin Mena [00:15:39]:
That's a great reason to be together and, You're right. I don't think that would have been the same thing if it was, like, a large group where they've got men and women.

Krista Tan [00:15:47]:
Yeah. Yeah. Exactly.

Benjamin Mena [00:15:49]:
And, yeah, if you wanna if you wanna give off, my I think it was, like, sometime early last year, like, my wife was just, like, popped open Apple Podcasts, hit me up, and it's just like, hey. Looking at your last guess, like, why don't you have more women?

Krista Tan [00:16:02]:
Oh.

Benjamin Mena [00:16:02]:
I was like, oh.

Krista Tan [00:16:04]:
Yeah. I like it right.

Benjamin Mena [00:16:05]:
Well, thank you for pointing that out.

Krista Tan [00:16:07]:
Exactly. Like, I need to be more intentional about this. Right?

Benjamin Mena [00:16:11]:
And I realized I need to be more intentional reaching out, but it was one of the things that I, Many times as a podcast host, I have a lot of people reaching out

Krista Tan [00:16:19]:
to me. Right.

Benjamin Mena [00:16:20]:
So, like, you know, part of part of the guest, like, guest list is just like people just like, hey, loves Love to share. Love to share it. I start realizing. I was just like, wait. There's a lot more men that are jumping up to share Yes. Than women. So Yes. Like, I'm I on purpose of, like because of my wife, which is I've been trying to be a little more intentional of, like, bringing out, like, different people

Krista Tan [00:16:42]:
Yes.

Benjamin Mena [00:16:43]:
All over, not just the people sticking their hands up.

Krista Tan [00:16:46]:
Exactly. Right. And, like, that is such a good point. And, you know, I think it goes back To a lot of that, like, confidence in the workplace and, you know, women might not wanna be the center of attention or, you know, wanna Reach their hand up and say, put me on your podcast, but I think we need to see more of that. So I love your wife, and thank her for me.

Benjamin Mena [00:17:08]:
She's not afraid to tell me how it is.

Krista Tan [00:17:09]:
Yeah. Right. Yes. Well, that's a good way for you.

Benjamin Mena [00:17:12]:
Now when it comes to, like, events, like, what kind of events are you guys, like, building for this community?

Krista Tan [00:17:17]:
Yeah. So we have so many things in in play right now. So, a big portion of our programming Our workshops. So we have 2 to 3. There it's usually been about 3 workshops per month, and those will range in topics From, like, employer branding, AI. There's a lot on AI right now given what we're going through. DEI, you know, how to influence, how to be a strategic Partner, those are just to name a few. We have knowledge shares every month.

Krista Tan [00:17:51]:
So that's where there's not necessarily a speaker who comes in as the expert, but we have a topic, and we all come with our, you know, our mind hive about, like, oh, I know this. So for example, We have 1 coming up that's about, like, the recruiter's tech stack. So everyone's gonna come share, like, what their favorite Tools are and, you know, how they use them and what size company they're at. So you kind of know, like, oh, I'm gonna look into that one or, like, this wouldn't work for me for a large company or small company, we have peer groups. So these are 6 to 8 women that meet monthly. We have about 6 of those going right now. And, really, this is where we see people building those, you know, deeper relationships where they can really bring their challenges of their day to day, Forward and, you know, talk with the group monthly about those. We are kicking off a mentor program in the new year.

Krista Tan [00:18:42]:
Very, very excited about that. It's It's gonna be awesome. We're in the process of putting all that together. And then in the new year, we're also gonna have an executive level of membership. So we're putting together programming for that and, you know, very special membership that is just for executives. And, again, wanna really create that safe space Where executives can come and share their challenges and get help from other executives. So, yeah, we have a lot going on. We have virtual fire sides.

Krista Tan [00:19:11]:
We have in person firesides. We've launched in a couple of different locations. So, obviously, got started here in the Bay Area, but we've also launched in LA and Seattle. And we're just waiting for more members to raise their hand and say, we wanna do this In New York or Chicago, and we know that's gonna happen as we continue to get, you know, more people spread out throughout the, the US and the world. We actually have A couple of members in Australia who are gonna start an Australian community that down there. So very excited to See people, you know, raising their hands to do that.

Benjamin Mena [00:19:46]:
Well, that's so exciting. And, like, what's game for the listeners? If if you're not in a community, recruiting community to go find a recruiting community, whether it's Talent Collective, you know, the elite recruiter podcast community, some of the other, like, Facebook communities. Like, The it's the one of the biggest powerful things is 1, like, you're not alone going through going through something. You're not alone on a challenge that you've had with a a client or a customer

Krista Tan [00:20:12]:
or

Benjamin Mena [00:20:12]:
a candidate. Like, there are so many times, like, we're like, a place like the Talent Collective Where you are free to ask the questions and you get great advice.

Krista Tan [00:20:22]:
Yes. If you can't do

Benjamin Mena [00:20:22]:
that on Twitter, you can't do that on Reddit. But if you find a curated community, There is so much power, and it it will help your career tenfold.

Krista Tan [00:20:32]:
Yeah. And, you know, one thing I'll add, I before starting Talent collective, I was a member of a couple of, leadership communities. Like, you know, this is for, like, Executives, but, like, it was very, like, agnostic as far as, like, what kind of industry. So, you know, there are people in my group that were, like, We're in, like, manufacturing or, like, advertising or event planning, and I really struggled to Connect. Like, I've learned things from them, but they weren't always super applicable to my business. And so what we're finding more and more is People coming to us saying, like, oh my gosh. Like, these are my people. Like, they understand exactly what I'm going through, and they can helped me with my challenge.

Krista Tan [00:21:18]:
Right? And so, like, I think that's been, you know, one of the the hugest blessings of this whole thing is that Women can actually get together with other is niche. Right? It's it's other women in TA that know exactly what you're going through. So

Benjamin Mena [00:21:34]:
And now real real quick, is this, like, mostly on the talent acquisition side, or is it a combination of talent acquisition and, like, the staffing or, like

Krista Tan [00:21:40]:
Both. Yeah. Agency side. We have a Pretty diverse membership, and we haven't necessarily like, it's it's not that niche where it's like, oh, this is only for in house or this is only for agency. We have people in, like, executive search. We have people like ICs in agencies. We have, founders of agencies that are a little bit larger in size. We have in house all the way through executives To, you know, recruiting coordinators and people in recruiting ops.

Krista Tan [00:22:12]:
So all of the above, anyone who is in the TA ecosystem, even some people who have that blend of, like, HR, like, the people upside and TA. For example, my last role in house was, I was head of people, so I had both under my purview. And we also have some members that, have, you know, A blend of of that that background as well.

Benjamin Mena [00:22:36]:
Awesome. And before we jump over to fractional recruiting, is there anything else that you'd like to chat about with the Talent Collective?

Krista Tan [00:22:42]:
Let's see. Yeah. I think, just to go back to your point about, you know, having that community and how valuable it is in your search, I'll give you a quick example of a recent situation that happened, and I I've heard this is happening a lot more than what I'm knowing about and hear about. We have a junior member who's she's been in recruiting for about 2 or 3 years, but she's on the exec search side. And so she's been more of that, like, sourcer researcher on the exec search side, and she wants to stay that route, but she She got laid off like many other people. So I know somebody who leads executive recruiting at Box. I put the 2 of them in touch even though I I didn't think Box was hiring for anyone, but I was like, it would be great for you 2 to know each other. Right? So they had a conversation.

Krista Tan [00:23:33]:
There are no openings Right now at her company, but she put this woman in touch with somebody who leads executive recruiting at Workday, And now that woman is interviewing at Workday. So just a really good example of that network and the connections that can be made, Especially right now, I mean, I just think planting those seeds and, like, being a part of this community is just gonna, like, Be this web that that's gonna spread throughout people's lives in so many ways that we don't even know about yet.

Benjamin Mena [00:24:05]:
I mean, once again, that's, like, The power of the community, like, in the networking community, and that's how jobs get made in place. Yeah. So that's awesome. Alright. Fractional recruiting. Yes. First of all, what the hell is fractional recruiting? Yeah. Everybody's talking about it.

Krista Tan [00:24:21]:
Yeah. So I'm gonna give my opinion, which, like, the true fractional people might wanna slap me because There are people that, like, you know, are have been fractional for a very long time and have a very strong viewpoint about what fractional is. And I think when you're talking about a fractional leader, like a strategic role, it's a little bit different than when you're talking about, like, a fractional recruiter, more of like I see working a job. Right? So fractional TA, like head of TA, Would be different than a consultant, different than a contractor. You're going into a company. You're You're gonna be there long term, and you're really going into a strategic role. Oftentimes, it is, you know, maybe 10 to 20 hours a week, so it's part time. You might have 3 or 4 of these clients at any given time, and you're really embedding yourself into the company.

Krista Tan [00:25:23]:
So you're a Part of the company, you're part of the strategy, you know all the people, you know all the ins and outs, and you're there for a longer period of time. A traditional consultant is seen more as, you know, somebody who comes in, like, on a project basis, is not a part of Company kinda like comes in, comes out, comes in, comes out. Right? On the recruiting side, not the strategic function, I think they're 1 and the same because, essentially, you know, last summer, I took on a a part I'm 10.99 role that was pretty similar to what I'm doing now. So I work at Talent Refinery, and And that is essentially a head fractional head of TA firm. And with that, you know, our founder, she gets in a lot of roles that, you know, they're like, well, we need help with recruiting as well. And so I take on those positions, and I think the biggest difference of, like, Consulting versus fractional in this case is our fee structure. So consultants are typically gonna be Hourly. Right? 10.99 an hourly.

Krista Tan [00:26:33]:
Our fee structure is different. So we do retained, but it's it's different than, like, an exec search retain model. It's a it's a monthly retainer. So we say, we'll guarantee you up to 10 hours a week on this search, and here's our monthly rate For it, our monthly, you know, 1 lump fee, and we get paid 100% upfront. So I'm really enjoying it, to be honest with you, So our clients are super, super motivated to fill the role within that month, and I've filled Several roles that I would have taken I think would have taken a lot longer, like a tax accountant role, marketing automation role that was very specific. It had to be, like, Pardot automation person. So, you know, I think the the benefit of having a model like this is the the clients already, like, Super bought in and super, like, have money on the line and most of the time doesn't wanna go into that 2nd month, which is great for me because then I can take on another project in that next month.

Benjamin Mena [00:27:32]:
Well and so I know 2023 has been about a a bit of an interesting year, and I think going into 2024 and 2025, I think the way that we recruiters provide services Mhmm. For our clients is going to definitely shift away from how it's been for the last 30 years.

Krista Tan [00:27:48]:
Great.

Benjamin Mena [00:27:48]:
What are some of the things that somebody like, if they're looking at adding a fractional segment of the recruiting business, what are some of the things that they should do or what's some advice that you would give them?

Krista Tan [00:27:58]:
Yeah. I think it depends on if you want to do Like, right now, I'm I'm working roles as, like, to make some money while I'm building Talent Collective. Right? Like and I'll probably work a roller too because I love it, and I wanna stay in the business. But it's not like, I don't see this as my full time job. I think it's different if you're gonna do that versus if you're gonna, like, go all in on fractional. If you're going all in and, like, you wanna have 3 to 4 clients at any given time and, like, this is your full time gig. I would set up a business. Right? Set up an See, set up some other kind of business structure and really look into that and and find whatever's right for you for, you know, taxes and all that good stuff.

Krista Tan [00:28:45]:
You're gonna need to invest in, like, a sales and marketing funnel. Right? Like, you need to build an engine that's gonna bring you in clients On a regular basis, you're gonna need the tools. Right? You're gonna need, like, an ATS, a CRM, like, all the things to really build an effective Pipeline for the roles you're filling. If you're doing fractional kind of, like, you know, maybe a roll or two, I don't think you need to set up a full business. Like, I'm a 10 like, on 10.99, essentially, you know, and I'm I pay my like, I don't have taxes taken out and all that good stuff. But I'm not gonna set up a whole business because this is gonna be, like, a portion of, you know, what I make. So I think it's a little different. And, like, I don't have an ATS.

Krista Tan [00:29:29]:
Like, I'm kinda working out of spreadsheets, and I do have a recruiting tool. Like, I use Recrupo, which is awesome for sourcing. I have LinkedIn recruiter light. I'm not going all in on the whole LinkedIn recruiter, like, full license. So I really think it depends on your intention. And, actually, one of the things that we're gonna be doing at Talent Refinery in the new year is we're gonna have a Put on a a fractional accelerator course, and so it's gonna be in person in the Bay Area. It's gonna be, you know, probably, like, 1 to 2 days and really teach people how to Set up that fractional business model. So if anyone is curious about that, please reach out to me.

Krista Tan [00:30:08]:
Would love to share more and, Get you on the calendar to come to that.

Benjamin Mena [00:30:13]:
Awesome. And so many times when you're coming in as a, like, a fractional recruiter, You're really just taking over just a few of their hard roles.

Krista Tan [00:30:21]:
Yes.

Benjamin Mena [00:30:22]:
Or you're really and you're are you working with companies that typically don't have Recruiting teams or large recruiting teams, are you coming in and supporting companies that have large recruiting teams that just don't have the bandwidth?

Krista Tan [00:30:34]:
Both. Both. Yeah. So the clients that I'm working with right now, one does not have a recruiting team. Very small company. I think it's about 10 people. The other one right now is I think they're, like, closer to, like, 50. They have a 1 person recruiting team, but That person, you know, doesn't have enough bandwidth to fill all the roles, so I'm coming in as, like, additional help.

Krista Tan [00:30:56]:
And then there's also like, I have a good friend. I just went on a walk with her this morning, so she was telling me all about how, like, all she has a huge recruiting team. You know, essentially, like, Executives were like, okay. We need to hire a 100 people by January, and so she brought in some fractional help for that. So, you know, I think that there's a use case for a lot of different sized companies for this.

Benjamin Mena [00:31:18]:
And if somebody's looking at picking up some, like, fractional clients, What is the pitch that you would give to a prospective client?

Krista Tan [00:31:26]:
Mhmm. Great. Yeah. Great question. So I think, It's it's depending on your price structure, it's gonna be much more cost effective than going with, You know, some like an agency, for example, you know, an, contingent agency, they're gonna charge, you know, 20 to 30% on the 1st year salary. This is a fraction of that. So I think from that perspective, it's, you know, very flexible. It's very cost efficient.

Krista Tan [00:31:57]:
And I think also there is that flexibility where, like, you can turn it off and on at any given time. Right? If you hire Hire someone on a full time basis. You know, you're locked into that person. You have them on your benefits. Like, you you don't wanna be just, like, Letting people go right and left and then have to rehire. Right? So it's more cost effective in that way too because you're not putting as much into hiring a full time person, Training that person, and then do you have enough work for them long term. Right? So it's it's more flexible, and it's More cost efficient, essentially.

Benjamin Mena [00:32:35]:
That's awesome. And before we move on, is there anything else that you'd love to share with the listeners about fractional recruiting?

Krista Tan [00:32:42]:
I think it's it's gonna be the way of 2024, honestly, and I don't know beyond that what's gonna happen, but this is Gonna be a very telling year for our industry given that the last 2 years have been such chaos and such, crisis for for our world. I think if if you're struggling to find employment and you can't find a full time job, This is this is it. Like, don't just sit around and wait for a full time job to come. You've gotta do something. You gotta take some action. And oftentimes, Just even working with 1 company or 2 company on a couple of roles, even just, like, puts that energy out into the universe that like, I'm being productive. I'm confident. Right? And so, like, I find, like, stuff comes to you.

Krista Tan [00:33:31]:
Right? Like, I'm a huge energy person. Like, you Put you put good energy out into the world, it's gonna come right back to you. So I just encourage people to really, not only look into it, but take action on it and and start Start working on some roles and start going after, you know, some business.

Benjamin Mena [00:33:46]:
That's awesome. Alright. Well, moving over to the quick fire questions, And this is probably, like, a a good question for you since you're actually talking to a lot of new recruiters too, but what advice would you give A brand new recruiter getting started in 2024 in our industry on how to become successful.

Krista Tan [00:34:08]:
Yeah. So we've talked a lot about this today. Network, network, network, relationships, relationships, relationships. I'll give you another good example. So, you know, over the last couple years, a lot of recruiters that I know have been let go, laid off. I have people reaching out to me daily, weekly saying, hey. I just got let go. I'm looking.

Krista Tan [00:34:30]:
If you know of anything you know, it's oftentimes on LinkedIn. If you know of anything, let me know. Few and far between, people have reached out and said, hey. Can we hop on a call? I'd love to see how you're doing. I'd love to fill you in on what's going on with me. Like, make the personal connection. That's What's memorable to people? Like, honestly, I think 2 people have actually, like, said, I would love to hop I would love to hop on a call with you. So I think it's and I remember those people, and I'm gonna think of them.

Krista Tan [00:35:02]:
Right? So I think it's just all about, like, making those real connections. Like, We're all people. We're in a human business. Right? Also, I think, like, informational interviews, that's actually how I When I was job searching in 2008, like, I was randomly reaching out to people on LinkedIn that were in recruiting. Like, hey. I know you don't have a job posting, but, like, can Can we talk? Can I can I ask you more about what you do on a day to day basis? Like and surprisingly, people are open to that. Right? It's it's so and people, like, especially Senior people, they wanna give back. They wanna, you know, pour into people who are just starting out their careers and give advice.

Krista Tan [00:35:41]:
So, Ask for it. Ask for the meeting. Ask for the conversation.

Benjamin Mena [00:35:46]:
I think that's, I'd love that you did that because if you wanna get back in 2009, Earl earlier days at LinkedIn, I was trying to move to from Orlando to Tampa, and I was working at a large defense contractor, Lockheed Martin. And I just Literally friend requested every single DOD recruiter in Tampa and just, hey. I know you don't have anything, But I'd love to chat with you.

Krista Tan [00:36:08]:
Yes. That's exactly what I do. Yeah. I think that is, like, not everyone's on LinkedIn at that point, so it was like, you know, kinda slim pickings. But I was just like I I I was reaching out to people in exec search because I was kinda like, oh, that's interesting, but I don't really know a lot about it. Right? Or like so, yeah, I think it's just such a good strategy.

Benjamin Mena [00:36:27]:
And I think for me at that time, I it turned into a 42% increase on my salary.

Krista Tan [00:36:32]:
There you go. Oh my gosh. That's amazing. Great. Congrats.

Benjamin Mena [00:36:37]:
So let's put that extra energy in there. So but, asking the same question, But for experienced recruiters, what advice would you give to them to be successful?

Krista Tan [00:36:48]:
Yeah. So, I mean, I think same as above. Right? Like, it's It's all about the relationships. It's all about, like, pouring into people and giving back and, you know, not just take, take, take as far as, like, The relationships that you're you're building, but also don't get stagnant. Like, I you know, looking back, I was at the same company for 13 years, and I've Heard very similar stories of people that have been with their company for 6 years or longer or, you know, even 4 years. And I think you can get to a place where you're just so, like, siloed in your own company and what your own company is doing, They're not really looking outside of that, and that's honestly one of the reasons we founded Talent Collective. Right? Because There's a lot of information out there that people don't know and aren't hearing, and we wanna help, you know, pour that into our recruiting community. So Don't get stagnant.

Krista Tan [00:37:43]:
Don't get complacent. You know, go out and seek out new information, innovation, what's going on in our industry To try to really stay cutting edge.

Benjamin Mena [00:37:52]:
Awesome. And has there been a book that has had a huge impact on your own personal career?

Krista Tan [00:37:58]:
Yes. So my favorite book career wise what is The Ideal Team Player by Patrick Lencioni. I there's a mantra that I keep in mind when I'm hiring now and, you know, just about, like, my team and whoever I want on my team, whoever I wanna work It's really it's hiring people that are hungry, humble, and smart. And I think the blend of those three Three things, like those qualities in people, trump many, many skills that they, you know, could bring into the job. So I always look for people that are hungry, humble, and smart.

Benjamin Mena [00:38:35]:
That's awesome. And did you have, like, a favorite RecTech tool at the moment?

Krista Tan [00:38:40]:
I do. I do. Yeah. So I use TextExpander, and it's not just for recruiting, obviously. You can use it for a lot of different things, but There's so many little, like, blurbs that I say on a day to day basis in my emails and my LinkedIn messages that are, like, this exact same thing. Like, Looking forward to hearing back, or here's a link to my calendar or whatever. So this essentially for those of the that those of you who don't know what it is, You program in these little snippets, and you can just, like, add, like, 3, you know, clicks of your keyboard, Have that sentence, you know, written out, and so it just saves a ton of time. You can also do it if you're, if you are actually recruiting and you have, like, You know, you have to write out these, like, in-depth, like, panels and preps and stuff like that.

Krista Tan [00:39:27]:
Like, you can, like, preprogram in a lot of those snippets, so you don't have to Type things out again and again and again.

Benjamin Mena [00:39:33]:
I wanna get your thoughts on, like, recruiting an AI. Now we've come to it's been a full year since, like, chat g p chat GPT has been out. Mhmm. Everything's like everybody's always talking about AI, but what's actually happening in recruiting?

Krista Tan [00:39:49]:
Yeah. That's a good question. I think a lot of us are still trying to figure that out and kind of like a wait and see a little bit. I've had a lot of fun testing out some AI products, and I feel very fortunate that I am working some roles so that I can be testing some tools. So, you know, I think I think what's gonna happen I'm kinda, like, in the middle here. Like, I think AI and New recruiting technology tools are going to help us get better and get more efficient. I do not think they're gonna replace our jobs. I think this is just too much of a human business, and more and more, I'm seeing people seeking out that connection That they don't want to be just talking to a bot.

Krista Tan [00:40:33]:
Right? Like, you can tell when you're talking to a bot. So, I think it's gonna help us but not replace All the jobs in our business.

Benjamin Mena [00:40:41]:
Yeah. Yeah. I know you're in the the valley, so you're, like, in the the space where everything's happening, so I had to ask that question. Now when it comes to your own personal success, what do you think has been a big driver of that?

Krista Tan [00:40:58]:
You know, in my younger days, I probably just would have attributed it to just, like, grit and resilience. Right? Like, I mentioned earlier in agency, there's just, like, so much going on every day and so many things that can go wrong and, you know, you just keep going, keep going, keep going. But I would say to add to that, the humor piece, like, trying to keep it light and trying to, you know, like, laugh things off at the end of the day. It really helps me to just move forward and, you know, have a sense of humor and not let it affect me, And just, you know, brush things off easily. And then also, like, having that abundance mentality and, like, It will come back to you twofold. Right? Like, I don't have the competitive mindset. Like, I'm not out to Get someone I'm just trying to do good and right by myself and, like, give back to others. I think those are the types of things that have really Just helped my mindset and helped me, you know, get through and and to do really well and be successful.

Benjamin Mena [00:42:02]:
That's awesome. And This favorite question, at least for me that I I love asking. If you could take everything that you know now and have a cup of coffee with yourself At the very beginning of your career, what would you tell yourself as a piece of advice?

Krista Tan [00:42:18]:
I would tell myself to travel more, honestly. I, you know, I think I just I worked way too much, and I wouldn't let other people Cover for me because I, you know, was like, oh, these are my clients. I need to, like, you know, service them, or I know what's going on. It's gonna be too much trouble to, like, Fill someone else in and then, like, get them you know, get back caught up when I come back, but I would have let other people cover my desk more and just go travel and see the world and, Yeah. Take more time off, honestly.

Benjamin Mena [00:42:50]:
Was there something that spurred that?

Krista Tan [00:42:52]:
Well, now I have 3 young child children, so It's a little bit harder to travel. Not that it's impossible, but and I'm also in a very different financial situation than it was. Like, when when The early days of recruiting were good. They were good. And, you know, I think I would have used my money more wisely to create a lot more experiences, but, you know, I still have time, and I still I'm still gonna do it. It's just I'm I'm gonna get back there.

Benjamin Mena [00:43:22]:
And now you're gonna be traveling with the Catawin Collective.

Krista Tan [00:43:25]:
Yeah. I and I am. I am. Yeah. Already had, you know, my Seattle trip, my LA trip, and I'm sure there's many more to come.

Benjamin Mena [00:43:32]:
Well, before I let you go, is there anything else that you'd love to share with the listeners?

Krista Tan [00:43:36]:
I think my last word of advice is Use this time, this downtime in our market or in our industry to learn something new. Don't just Sit there and wallow in that. I can't find a job. Right? It can be easy to caught up be caught up obsessing about your job search every day, especially when you have bills to pay. So I I have empathy towards all of that, but take this time to invest in yourself. You may never get some time like this again in your career, so Try to do some good with it and see it as a blessing.

Benjamin Mena [00:44:09]:
That that is awesome. Well, definitely excited for everybody to listen to this podcast. And if you are not in a community, first of all, if, you know, hit up CRISSA to to check out the Talent Collective. But whatever you can do in 2024, try to find the community that's right for you. Because At least for me, if it wasn't for why the recruiting communities, and this was a Facebook group, we would have never launched our business, and we would have been in a completely different place. And because of that, like, it has had such a huge impact on my family. And just think a little a little Facebook group has had that much impact. So on me.

Benjamin Mena [00:44:47]:
So if you find the right community for you, whether it's Talent Collective or any other community Mhmm. It's going to pay dividends in your life If you're involved in the community.

Krista Tan [00:44:58]:
Yeah. Okay. Thank you.

Benjamin Mena [00:44:59]:
Hope you guys hope you guys crush it in 2024. We are all gonna win together, And, definitely thank you for listening.

Krista Tan [00:45:06]:
Thanks, Benjamin.

Intro [00:45:07]:
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