Success, Challenges, and Building a First-Class Recruitment Business with Stuart Mitchell

Benjamin Mena [00:00:00]:
Coming up on this episode of the Elite Recruiter podcast. At your core, what do you think has been the reason why you're seeing success out there?

Stuart Mitchell [00:00:08]:
These are two, like, probably not the most altruistic answers, but, like, some of it is spite. There's a couple of people along the way that have told me that I'm a fad and it's never going to work out. Treat people like that, you're going to run into them in ten years time. If you treat people like a commodity, then you'll get the exact same respect in return.

Benjamin Mena [00:00:25]:
Welcome to the Elite Recruiter podcast with your host, Benjamin Mena, where we focused on what it takes to win in the recruiting game. We cover it all from sales, marketing, mindset, money, leadership, and placements. Excited about this episode of the Elite Recruiter podcast. Our guests did $1.6 million in his company in his first year of business. But we're not going to talk about that. We're going to talk about the lessons he learned now that he's on year two. He has done multiple interviews, and I highly recommend to go check out every single one of those. One, they're great podcasts.

Benjamin Mena [00:01:02]:
And two, he talks about different lessons that he learned at those points in time. But I'm excited to have him on here so that way we can talk about, like, the lessons that he learned going into year two of Hampton north. So, Stuart Mitchell, I'm excited to have you. Welcome to the podcast.

Stuart Mitchell [00:01:15]:
Hey, thanks for having me on. Been looking forward to this one for a while.

Benjamin Mena [00:01:18]:
So real quick, before we start doing a deep dive in your background, can you tell the audience and the listeners that don't know you a little bit about yourself in Hampton north?

Stuart Mitchell [00:01:26]:
Yeah, so it's Stuart Mitchell. I'm british. I've lived in the US for ten years. I spent some time in the New York City, southern California, now based in central Connecticut. I founded Hampton north. By the time this podcast goes out, probably two years to the day, I founded it in the first week of September of 2022, really to serve the cybersecurity community, essentially. I know a lot of companies who have a cybersecurity practice or it's a small part of their business. I really wanted to create a home for a the cybersecurity community, but also the very best cybersecurity recruiters to work in a place where that business is front and center, not just bolted onto an area of the business.

Stuart Mitchell [00:02:02]:
So two years in business with five headcount, slowly growing, but growing at the right pace and really excited.

Benjamin Mena [00:02:09]:
Awesome. So let's dive in. Okay. You know, listening to mother podcast, me doing some homework on you before you got into recruiting, and I wanted you to tell the story, but you got fired. What was it, nine times?

Stuart Mitchell [00:02:19]:
Yes, I. So, going back a long way. Right. So, 14 or 15, very sharp, intelligent child. Thankful for my parents in terms of the intellect that they passed down onto me. I didn't do much with it. And, you know, 1415 that, you know, the letters coming through the door were for Oxford and Cambridge. By the time I'd finished my exams, I'd found women, alcohol, cars, sports, anything that didn't help my career.

Stuart Mitchell [00:02:48]:
And I ended up not going to college and finding myself a little bit lost. So I, you know, in my hometown, I kind of bopped around. I did every job possible, and just, you know, the problem was, is that I had this. This potential, but I just couldn't find it. And given I had no qualifications, there was really not the right type of jobs to really use that mental output. So I got fired a bunch. I'm lucky I didn't fall into any worse trouble than the fact that I couldn't keep a job. But, yeah, I mean, there's people that whenever I go home, I run into.

Stuart Mitchell [00:03:20]:
I'm like, hey, you fired me. You remember? So, you know, you see it a lot, right? It happens in sports, it happens in education. Right? Folks to, if they can't harness their potential. And sometimes you even see it in staffing agencies, right? Like those folks who are not harnessed and channeled the right way, they become a distraction and they become toxic. And, you know, if I look back, I was young. This all happened before I turned 23. So it happened a bunch while I was a kid, but, yeah, couldn't keep a job, wasn't stable. And then, yeah, finally.

Stuart Mitchell [00:03:48]:
Finally found recruitment, which really kind of built the platform for stability for me.

Benjamin Mena [00:03:53]:
And how did you end up finding about recruiting? Did you just fall into it like all of us?

Stuart Mitchell [00:03:58]:
Yes, essentially. There's a guy who still. He still works in talent acquisition now, back in my hometown, he's had a fairly decorated career, I guess maybe five or six years older than me and sound very british, but I was just heading to a cricket match, and this guy must have been 25, 26 at the time. Picks me up in this brand new BMW, and I'm like, hey, what did he do then? You have this car, and he's like, oh, what's in recruiting? And I'm like, he hire me. Like, that sounds sick. Like, I want to do that. I want a brand new BMW. And so he referred me to a friend of his who focused more on the entry level piece.

Stuart Mitchell [00:04:30]:
They're a little bit more kind of exec search based, but a friend of his was hiring entry level talent, so fell into it somewhat strategically, but not really. Just knew it was a way to make a good living. I didn't really know too much about it. And then, yeah, found my first job in my hometown, Northampton, which is where Hampton north comes from. Did that for about eight to nine months, and then realized that the bigger and better kind of global international opportunities were in London. So in 2012, I would say, picked up my first, let's say, big boy job in London, and I went down there, and, yeah, the rest is history, William.

Benjamin Mena [00:05:03]:
And about when during your timeline did you end up in the United States?

Stuart Mitchell [00:05:08]:
So I was only in London for a couple of years. I moved to New York. When I was looking back, I was very young. I was 24. I'd never been. And, you know, at the time, I had an american love interest, which made things a little bit more. It was wrapping up their studies in the UK. And so I, you know, I started speaking to my current employer.

Stuart Mitchell [00:05:27]:
I started interviewing at some other places, and my current employer transferred me to New York. And that's really where I think my career, you know, it really kind of kicked forward. Yeah. 2014 was when I made that jump to the US.

Benjamin Mena [00:05:41]:
I mean, you could have easily stayed in your hometown for at least in London, and everything, I think, would have worked out for perfectly outside the love interest. Why did you actually make the jump over to the side of the pond?

Stuart Mitchell [00:05:52]:
Yeah. So there's a couple of reasons. So, the first thing is, my dad plays the similar trail. My dad is from New Zealand. He moved to the UK. And so I think that kind of itchy feet syndrome of like, hey, this is a great opportunity. My hometown, London's not going anywhere. What's the worst that can happen? Right? The worst thing is it sucks.

Stuart Mitchell [00:06:10]:
And in six months, you go home. But, you know, I never. I think some people, when they have large families and whatnot, they are compelled to stay because everybody stays, and it's what they do. I think, you know, having someone in your corner, like a parent, who's like, yeah, why would you not do that? That sounds amazing. And my mom also is very supportive, but having someone who blazed that trail just made it a lot easier. I feel like a lot of people have unnecessary and unfair pressures from parents, from siblings, from loving just whatever. To not be able to take opportunities like that. So think about the right support system, and then with the best will in the world, I think, you know, my friendship group, it's like a much more diluted version of good will hunting where they were like, I obviously don't have that level of juice, but they're like, if you stay, like, you've let us all down.

Stuart Mitchell [00:06:57]:
So I do think my friends know that I was always kind of destined to do something bigger and better and more exciting, and they fully supported it. Right? They were kind of like, if I was still there, they'd be like, hey, you failed. You let yourself down. So having a friendship group that were fully behind me going in and chasing what I needed to chase is super. Like, I'm super grateful for that.

Benjamin Mena [00:07:19]:
I want to go back in a bit and talk about the UK versus US recruiting market, but fast forward. So New York, California. You're now in Connecticut?

Stuart Mitchell [00:07:27]:
Yeah.

Benjamin Mena [00:07:27]:
When did you launch your own firm? And I guess, how did you get to that point of like, hey, I'm going to go create my own business?

Stuart Mitchell [00:07:33]:
I'd made the decision, I think probably with about a year before I left my previous place, I kind of made the decision that there was nowhere, really for me to go from a growth perspective. So I got as high as I could from a promotion perspective, there were things that I wanted to do differently that a much wider business didn't want to do. And the reality is, it was their business. My job was to make recommendations. If they didn't want to follow them like that, absolutely fine. And they're a very successful business. And, you know, whatever will be, will be. But I think, you know, the reality is, a.

Stuart Mitchell [00:08:07]:
My priorities changed. I think what I am super motivated by now is to create a legacy. It's kind of hard to do that under somebody else's umbrella. I think the other thing is, and this is the financial chaser in me, is like, there comes a time where, you know, I built such a profile that I felt like I became the show that may come with a certain level of arrogance, but, like, the reality is within my domain, I was so well known that it almost was. I think a lot of people were surprised that I didn't own the firm because of how much I cared and because I really did enjoy working there. But I think people assume because of my passion and dedication for that business that I was at the very least a partner and I wasn't. And when people are saying that to you, it's like, okay, well, maybe I can do this. And so I started to have those thoughts.

Stuart Mitchell [00:08:52]:
And, you know, the reality is it's not easy and we'll kind of get into this. Took for granted some of the things that happen in the shadows of a recruiting business that maybe when you're a business facing and team facing a lot of stuff that does happen that keeps you up at night at times, and that is a lot more to think about. But I just think it was time for me to, if you can't create the change that you want to be. And I interviewed with some other companies that I don't think was impressive as where I was working previously. So I was like, if I'm going to work for a company, I'm going to stay here. But ultimately I wanted to kind of blaze my own trail and do things my way. And hey, if I'm wrong and things don't play out, I'm fairly confident that somebody would hire me, given my background and network and experience. But I think I can make a run at this.

Stuart Mitchell [00:09:36]:
And I think where I'm, you know, where I'm seeking legacy, where I'm seeking flexibility, where I'm seeking freedom, these are things that having my own farm enables me to do well.

Benjamin Mena [00:09:46]:
Looking back on that, I know, like, you've had some conversations with people, like, it was a magic mailbox where Stewart was bringing in business. Is there anything that they could have done to keep you?

Stuart Mitchell [00:09:58]:
Maybe. I try not to kind of dwell on that. I think the reality is it was a wonderful five years. And I look back on Ann. I'm super grateful for what they gave to me, and I'm fairly certain that they're pretty happy with what I gave to them. I think it was one of those things. And candidly, I had this discussion where, like, maybe eight or nine months before, I was like, this just kind of feels like it's coming to its natural conclusion. And it did.

Stuart Mitchell [00:10:23]:
So I think it's one of those things, maybe, but I also think, like, would they have enjoyed what it might have taken to keep me? Like, I may have made some other people very uncomfortable. And so there's a lot of kind of metaverse type examples where things are very different right now, but I think, you know, on both sides, I'm certain that they're over it now. And I kind of moved on and I'm blazing my own trail, as I say.

Benjamin Mena [00:10:46]:
And I want to get past the starting point because you've actually did a lot of really good interviews focusing on the starting point. But is there one or two good stories from your launch that either helped you come off, start successfully, or that lesson that you learned, that could help somebody else launch, right?

Stuart Mitchell [00:11:03]:
Yeah, I think this is one I preach often, but money in the bank versus invoices out and handshake deals are two very, very, very different things for first time founders. I think as a, you know, as a sales manager or as a director, you're like, okay, well, I know this is coming in, so I'm going to hire three people and I'm going to run this event or I'm going to go on this travel. When you're watching the accounts receivable or you're waiting for how long it actually takes to get paid as a recruitment owner, those things are very different. And so I think the reality is just like it's such a cliche, but cash skin, take care of your bank balance. The second is, I think, be very, very, very clear on what is a long term profitable structure from a hiring perspective. And what I mean by that is whether you operate in a draw, whether you work on commission only, whether your base plus salary plus benefits, which is, sorry, base plus commission plus benefits, which we are, we pay very well and we do that so that we can attract very high talent. But at some point the ads make some tweaks in later stages, which is not what you want to be doing because I was too generous, right? And then all of a sudden it's like, okay, well, I'm not running a not for, I was end up running a not for profit for a little bit, even though we were billing because we're too generous around commission because I wanted to do better. But you still have to make profit as a business.

Stuart Mitchell [00:12:22]:
You've got to remember that there's tax implications and insurance and lots of other things that are more expensive than maybe you consider as an individual contributor. So really just make sure that you have crunched your numbers to make sure that you're going to be a profitable business because otherwise your hand gets forced and you don't want to be making tighter decisions. So that's definitely one. And then I think I was probably early on too flattered that people wanted to work for me. In my head were this like nothing, 2345 person company. And so I'm like, okay, well, why are people reaching out to work here? Like, of course, like, we'd love that, etcetera. You know, the reality is we have some incredible people and we have some unbelievable clients and we have a really good culture here. And so again, on that mark of being too generous, et cetera, I don't think you need to be, as a new founder, you don't need to be flattered.

Stuart Mitchell [00:13:17]:
People are always going to push the envelope in terms of what's in it for them. But I think the reality is if you're creating a first class business, which is a lot of effort, I think the reality is you're paying your people well, you're taking care of them. You don't need to be flattered and keep giving, giving, giving, giving. And I think particularly during that post pandemic boom where recruiters were so kind of sought after and everything, streets were favored with gold to them. I think there was a lot of giving because everyone was billing stupid numbers. So you could kind of be too exceptionally generous because your businesses were making so much money. But you don't need to be over generous and be fluttered when people want to work for your company. It's a business relationship.

Stuart Mitchell [00:13:57]:
You know you're giving them a good opportunity. You have to expect a lot in return.

Benjamin Mena [00:14:01]:
If you have not following Stuart Mitchell on LinkedIn, make sure to go click and follow. You're absolutely incredible with LinkedIn. I know you've been playing the LinkedIn game for a long time, and you've mentioned a few times that people were reaching out to you to work for you. Your current team right now is a team of killers.

Stuart Mitchell [00:14:17]:
Yeah.

Benjamin Mena [00:14:18]:
How did you even go about finding, like, a team of killers?

Stuart Mitchell [00:14:22]:
So these are people that actually I was trying to hire for a very long time. These are folks within my network. So if we don't start to reason, like, Ruby is someone who I'd connect to. I worked with one of her peers previously. She reputationally was just off the charts unbelievable, and so just wanted to work together. So she reached out when I was traveling to California, and it was just a match made in heaven. So that worked out. James was somebody I've been speaking to for three, four, five years.

Stuart Mitchell [00:14:53]:
Couldn't make it work where I was previously. So, you know, he was one of the first people I wanted to call and so got him over. Ross, very similar situation. I've been probably, he's probably been on my, like, wanted to work for me for six years. He's that impressive. And I finally got him on the right day. And then Hoda is someone who we've kind of been ships passing in the night in terms of who we know and who we potentially worked with. But she's very experienced.

Stuart Mitchell [00:15:18]:
She's helping build out a new market for us, a market that is kind of partner aligned in terms of what we're trying to achieve. And just from a DNA and ethos perspective, we were speaking maybe for seven or eight months before it happened, and it just kind of felt right. So these are not knee jerk. We're not waiting for somebody to come in or anything like that. We know that we want pair. There's five or six people that I think are on the list, essentially people that I want to be here. We might not get everybody, but I think we'll get two or three more of folks. And look, you're right.

Stuart Mitchell [00:15:52]:
And I think it's strange, right? I think people, people assume that if they come here, that their job is going to be easier, and that's why some people reach out. But I don't believe that. I think, like, recruitment is hard, right? And you don't just go to an agency and it's like, bang, I've got 100 job orders because I work for Hampton north or whoever, right. It's wherever you go comes with its own unique challenges. I think the culture and the expectations here are very different. I think the reality is I won't let standards slip. I'm such a stickler for high standards. And I think quality of work is probably prioritized over output.

Stuart Mitchell [00:16:27]:
As long as the input is there. We're not a volume shop. The way we treat the market is so important. And that's why our response rates from cold outreach and from networking messages, et cetera, is a lot higher. I'm not saying that, and hire doesnt always mean that you pull a job or you pull a client. But I think we operate on a respect basis with the way that we work with the community. And so we expect like one in ten emails. People come back to us and just say, hey, look, we have our handle on this, or thats probably not what we need, or something like that.

Stuart Mitchell [00:16:56]:
We expect a 10% return rate on our cold outreach because of the reputation that we have. And if you can just get that right, it does make life easier. But the reality is you dont just walk into a desk full of hot jobs. And I think some people assume that if they come here, that recruitment will be easy again. We've had our struggles, we had a very difficult q two. And you know, the reality is where we sat down on the first week of July, we had some very frank conversations, and, you know, we're seeing the benefits of it now. But you know, recruitment is still very high. Doesn't matter where you go.

Stuart Mitchell [00:17:28]:
There is no silver bullet. It's just around the people. You just want to be working with great people and I. Who you surround yourself with is really going to be the output that you get.

Benjamin Mena [00:17:36]:
Okay, so for the listeners, all these people, like, your entire team is 100% remote.

Stuart Mitchell [00:17:40]:
Yes.

Benjamin Mena [00:17:41]:
How are you, like, you know, tracking? Like, how do you, like KPI's metrics? How do you build a high performance remote team?

Stuart Mitchell [00:17:49]:
Yeah. So the first is hire people that actually want to do the job, because I would fathom that like, 70% of people in our industry just, like, don't know what else to do. So they're just here, and if there's a chance for them to, like, if there's a chance to slack off, they'll do it. Like, if they can get away with stuff, they'll do it. If they can push some KPI's to make themselves look busy, they'll do it. Regardless of, you know, the stats and the KKI's and whatever. I have to trust them that, like, they're doing the job right, which I do right. And that's something that is super important.

Stuart Mitchell [00:18:19]:
In terms of internal communications, we're always in slack. We have our own channels. We have three weekly cadence calls. As a collective, it's difficult. We run across 8 hours of different time zones. So we have those challenges, but the reality is those cadence calls are important. We set ourselves weekly pledges. We converse about how we're getting on against those.

Stuart Mitchell [00:18:38]:
We share winning moments, whether that's great client meetings, whether that's a new job pulled, whether that's a candidate going to a final, whether that's a buyback from a spec of a client that we've been trying to get. We share a lot of those collective wins, and that's so important. But you can have all the stats in the world, but you can type anything you want into the system. Unless I spend my whole time really, really in depth reviewing, reviewing, reviewing. That is not the business leader that I want to be. I've had to do that with one of the team. And I said, look, if I ever have to do this again, this is not going to work, because that is not the leader that I want to be, that I have to review such things under a microscope. I want to be reviewing improvements.

Stuart Mitchell [00:19:17]:
I want to be looking at data saying, hey, anytime you get four first interviews, your fill rate goes from 50% to 85%. Go and get four first interviews. But that's the kind of data that I want to be looking at. I don't want to be looking at, are you doing your damn job? Like I want to be looking at it like, okay, well, you're billing 400, 500. If we can just tweak these three things, we can move that to 575, 600. And so that's really the kind of way that we look at it and it's all underbuilt on trust. And I wonder where almost the team are kind of. They do the management for me, right.

Stuart Mitchell [00:19:49]:
If you have a team of high performers like Michael Jordan didn't let someone else make a bad pass or a bad shot, right. Like, the players would look at them without having, you know, what's. Phil Jackson didn't have to say, like, hey, this is what you need to do. Like, the best players should just, like, if someone's not doing their job, they should just look at him and say, hey, what the are you doing? And if not, like, if you're not doing your job, you need to kind of, like, I say it quite brutally. If you don't want to be here, like, don't be here, but if you want to be here, like, I can make this the very best place in the world to work. But we're having our, you know, we've had offsites in New York, Los Angeles, Boston. We do this quarterly. Las Vegas.

Stuart Mitchell [00:20:25]:
We're doing our holiday party in London this year, which is, you know, huge for us teams. So when we get together, it's deliberate, it's exciting. We really enjoy each other's company and we definitely don't want to lay each other down. But, you know, the standards are set and it's a great place to work, but if you're phoning it in, like, it's not going to work out.

Benjamin Mena [00:20:43]:
How do you handle like. And I know that the company has evolved. Initially started, everything was on you. Your Brad, your personal brand was bringing in the business. And I know it's evolved to. A lot of your team members are bringing in their own work, filling their own work, running a 360 desk. How do you manage? You still being a top biller plus mentoring, coaching, managing a whole other team?

Stuart Mitchell [00:21:11]:
Yeah, I think the first thing is like, having a high performing team means I don't like, I can spend. I probably do like 40, 50% of my time recruiting. It might not sound like a lot. That's quite a lot, right. For a business owner. Like, I think that's probably more than most. And with that 40, 50% of my time, I can do 600 because of my network, because of just like, my overall savviness and just like, yeah, I can. I can kind of blag it and get it done.

Stuart Mitchell [00:21:39]:
The second part is like, I like work. I'm not nine five. Like I can assure you I'm not a nine to five guy. I'm a like seven to four, six to nine. Like I like doing my job. I'm on the road a lot. I spend a lot of time with you know, candidates, clients doing speaking engagements. So there is no way that you get like, and I'm not going to say like this, plenty of people that are more successful than me, I wouldn't have the life that I could have like that I have now if I was working nine five.

Stuart Mitchell [00:22:07]:
I work a lot and that's okay because I enjoy it and it's my business. Right? Like you know I should be the hardest working person here. I don't want to be that CEO who doesn't do anything and the team kind of hates them but they have the Ferrari and whatever. Don't get me wrong, if I build this off my back in 1015 years and then I'm happy to be that CEO parachute in. But like right now while we're in the grind years, I want to grind harder than anybody else. That's so, so, so important and that's exactly what a leader and a founder of a scrappy, small early stage recruitment company should be doing. I think where my blind spots are actually more on the strategic piece of. Okay, well how do we get from seven to 25 people? What does a business need to look like? What type of hires do we need to make? What are the structure needs to look like? Im the scrappy zero to one guy.

Stuart Mitchell [00:22:57]:
I left my previous business because it was growing and it was going to be corporate and those big strategic fluffy stuff in my head I dont want to be spending too much time on that. But as the business is growing I can tell you that were missing some of that and Im hiring and im getting coaching on some of the stuff that is in my blind spot. But ultimately this stuff is important. But going back to the original question, I like my job. I have a really good team. Recruitment to me is still interesting. I love FaceTime with clients. I go to everything and it just helps me tenfold for all the recruiters.

Benjamin Mena [00:23:33]:
That I watch online and where I work. But I also watch a lot of recruiters. I think you are spending more time with clients face to face than just about every other recruiter out there. Do you think that's making a difference?

Stuart Mitchell [00:23:45]:
Yes. And I think within, look within my world I found a world where people like and appreciate me and my style and it's worked out beautifully for me in terms of the response that I have had since I've spent, you know, started doing a bunch of Facetime. And I think, you know, the reality is I'm an executive now. I'm speaking to other executives. I think we communicate on the same level. And, you know, ultimately, I think having done that, like, I know, like, other agencies get scared when they're like, okay, Stu's going to see X or y. Like, okay, we're done here. And even my colleagues have started to see it.

Stuart Mitchell [00:24:23]:
Like, if I bring Stu in, let him do his thing where he, like, holds court and let's host a dinner and whatever, and that's my sweet spot. That's my domain. That's what I'm very good at. And so my colleagues have used that. Like, hey, we're going to go down. Like, these guys want to meet us. Can you do this? And, you know, the more they do it, like, Ross has been a great example, right? He's like, Stu, these guys want us to go to Chicago. Can you come? Like, absolutely, yes.

Stuart Mitchell [00:24:46]:
We come back, six new engagements, another new client off the side of it, because that's where I'm good. And honestly, like, you would hope so, right? I've been doing this a long time, but I don't want to be. I don't think I'm as compelling via email or via slack or whatever. Like, if I get out in front of people, I have, like, a more of a likability factor than perhaps I have in my written tone or even on the phone. But once I'm in front of people, like, to me, it's game over if I don't win. I'm shocked.

Benjamin Mena [00:25:13]:
You've mentioned the word reputation about five or six times. You're probably one of the first people that have said that word on the podcast that many times. So why is reputation so important in your space, and how has it helped you?

Stuart Mitchell [00:25:26]:
I don't think this matters in every domain. Some domains are just so big that it doesn't matter. Like, if you take software engineering, right? Like, software engineering is every company, right? And this community is so big, and there's a new client every day splitting up that you can piss people off into infinity, and it doesn't matter. The cybersecurity community is extremely unforgiving. It is a different beast in terms of they are professionally paranoid and they don't like to work with people they don't know and they don't trust. I've spent years building that. We call it social capital. We can call that reputation, whatever it may be.

Stuart Mitchell [00:26:00]:
And that's why I'm like, personally, I won't go down the grad model of hiring because I think, like, that volume, volume, volume, not really understanding your market, not really understanding what you're talking about, not really understanding the caliber or the people that you're talking to or what you're saying. Like, that's. To me, that's reputational suicide. And, you know, this job is hard enough, but it's even harder when you're. When, let's say, six months ago, someone was sat in your seat with your territory, and they sucked. And it's like, wow, we spoke to Jimmy or Hannah or Sandeep, and we hated them. So you're done because you're affiliated with that brand. I never, ever, ever want that to happen to anyone from Hampton north.

Stuart Mitchell [00:26:38]:
I've been on the other side of it, and it's embarrassing when you get a message back from somebody saying, hey, we dealt with the Hampton north guys two years ago, and they sucked, but there is no way we'd ever work with them again. Or, hey, they ghosted us on a search. We're not interested in engaging them again. Not for me. You know, the bigger you get, this is obviously harder to manage, but I see it so often where it's like, wow, you hired that person. That is reputational suicide. And I would rather not hire people and just have the elite team that we have that are treating, you know, we say, like, honor the badge. Right? Because if you're not treating it with respect, like, to me, that's a huge no.

Stuart Mitchell [00:27:15]:
If you're doing something that could be detrimental to me or to your colleagues moving forward, like, get out. You're not welcome there.

Benjamin Mena [00:27:21]:
Absolutely love that. Well, I want to jump back into, like, the business lessons.

Stuart Mitchell [00:27:25]:
Yeah.

Benjamin Mena [00:27:25]:
So you had an incredible first year from year one to year two. What do you think some of the biggest lessons that you learned?

Stuart Mitchell [00:27:33]:
I stepped away from the tools, I would say, too quickly. You know, we had. So I'll kind of give you a timeline of where I think the boat starts a rock for us in year two. So we had a good up until, like, last year was great. Like, last year was great. I. We had a good January or February, and I was like, okay, like, I'm going to get really strategic now. I'm going to start, like, building out websites and content, and you guys don't really need me at the minute.

Stuart Mitchell [00:27:58]:
Like, it's, you know, we're cooking. You know, we went through a phase of doing over $200,000 month to month a month, which is where we were trying to be as a team of six, kind of get to that. Targeting 2.4 million. I think we were targeting 2.8. I think we're probably going to add somewhere between two two and two four now. But, you know, ultimately things are good. I don't need to be in the field as much and I did it too, like soon. So I'd say from like March, April, May, I kind of took a step back too much.

Stuart Mitchell [00:28:24]:
Some personal stuff that where I was kind of in the business kind of not. And it was actually I should have. Like, if I look back, I was in the headspace that my team are good enough that if I had stepped away for a month, let them run with her. I do think the business. If I'm looking back on my own personal performance situation, if I'd have stepped back for a month and let the team run out versus dealing with the stuff that I had to deal with, but then dipping backwards and forwards almost like a skeleton of myself, but not allowing the team to flourish without me. If I could go back and do that again, I would have just taken the month of May out and come back June fresh. But I kind of stang the room out. If I'm looking back on my own leadership performance, I just wasn't in the right headspace to be doing what I needed to be doing and I didn't trust the team enough and that's a weakness on my end.

Stuart Mitchell [00:29:10]:
But ultimately I think I went off the tools too soon. We fell in a little bit in love with our own noise and it's really easy to do when everything is going really well. You're like, wow, we're crushing. We're making money like this and things are great so we don't have to work as hard, right. Because everyone loves us and we're awesome. And the reality is I looked at our Q one inputs and I looked at our Q two inputs and Q one was close to double Q two. Guess what? We did double the numbers in Q one as we did to Q two. Like, you know, you can, you can coast.

Stuart Mitchell [00:29:43]:
Even if you're really good, you can still slow down, you can still coast. And we just took our foot off the gas in terms of, I would say the, the rigor and the consistency and just the. We trusted the recruitment gods too much and the recruitment gods had, do not fare well. Whereas, you know, if you have three people at final, they really love two and one is okay. Like you're probably good versus, hey, we've got one person laying process. We like fingers crossed. Guess how often fingers crossed comes in. It doesn't like, it rarely happens.

Stuart Mitchell [00:30:18]:
And just like lazy old, you know, stuff that everyone falls into the trap of. So we came back July 1 and, you know, looked at what our expectations are as a business, who we're trying to be, what that takes. Right. Because, again, it doesn't matter if your reputation is wonderful, if you're not doing any work. I can just have a really good reputation, play golf every day. I have to still work hard, and so do the team. But we've had a good kind of introspected look of who we are, why we're here. And I would say our deal cycles are anywhere from four to six weeks.

Stuart Mitchell [00:30:52]:
And it's no surprise that August has been the best that we've had as a business. We still got two weeks left. There's a world where we double our best. You know, we're kind of knocking on the door of a four, $500,000 month, which for us, you know, we were prior to that, our best was in the twos. If we can do this this month, I think, like a. It will set us up very nicely for the rest of the year. It already has, but also just that, you know. Okay, well, we just absolutely went flat out, and I get that there has to be some balance.

Stuart Mitchell [00:31:19]:
You can't be. You can't go 110% every day of the year. It's impossible. And I. I know that you have to manage workload on that, but this is what, you know, if you are all in, this is what it looks like. And I think that excitement and spark is back. And now it's like, okay, well, my job is now to not let those standards slip because, okay, well, I've got data based on. Okay, well, if you're doing this, this is that bad quarter we had.

Stuart Mitchell [00:31:41]:
If you're doing this, this is what it can look like. And so, again, going back to the point of how do you manage a remote team? All the information is there because we're using the. I wouldn't say KPI's, but we're using our data of the work that we're doing the right way, using the database the right way, so that we're able to predict future performance. And that's so, so, so important, because then we know what's worth that time, what's not.

Benjamin Mena [00:32:06]:
How are you tracking, like, the performance.

Stuart Mitchell [00:32:08]:
In terms of, like, on a granular, like, daily web. On a granular?

Benjamin Mena [00:32:12]:
Yeah, yeah, yeah.

Stuart Mitchell [00:32:13]:
So we use a CRM called Vinceri we set different weekly. Usually our monthly and quarterly cadences look very similar, but weekly we basically do an assessment of where our desk is because most of our guys and girls are full desk. If we're very job rich, it's like, okay, we need to spend 80% of the week on delivery. We still need to be doing 20% on business development outreach. That never stops. If we're working on maybe one or two vacancies or the lower quality vacancies, we switch that up. We're doing 80% business development, networking, LinkedIn outreach, etcetera. So I think the reality is the weeks always look very different, but I think the months and the quarters end up looking collectively the same.

Stuart Mitchell [00:32:51]:
But we're basically trying to stay level against a roller coaster of recruitment of, like, hey, had a really good month, but now I've got no jobs again because I did four deals, and so now I've got no vacancies because those clients don't need me anymore. And that always happens, I think, for, like, other than, like, I would say, like, the top one to 2% of recruiters who are just, like, always busy and always have stuff on the. They always know where they're next. The deals are coming this month. They know what's coming in 30, 45 days because they've already kind of got those engagements in place, and they know where the clients are coming from in the 90 days. That's a different level of a lead recruiter. There's some that can spin up new clients in a heartbeat. I've never been that person.

Stuart Mitchell [00:33:29]:
I think for me, it's more, okay, well, I can predict based on conversations from two months ago, five months ago, who's going to be recruiting for me in October, who's coming in November, who's probably. December's a little bit far away, but, you know, I can always see, like, 90 days out what's coming when and kind of manage my time and resources accordingly.

Benjamin Mena [00:33:47]:
You just said that August is looking at being an absolute, like, double what you ever done. Yeah, the June and July. Did you guys, like, increase the work, or was it just like, from July?

Stuart Mitchell [00:33:59]:
No, from July, there was more work, tighter rigor, more collaborative around, like, what projects we were working on, etcetera. We used to have every other Friday off. We could have free Friday start from another company. Fine. We parked up like, we're behind. You don't do good stuff when you're not playing well. So parked out for the quarter. We'll review that.

Stuart Mitchell [00:34:18]:
And just the expectations went up. What was expected on a weekly basis, what was expected against every vacancy. And yet the volume of activity was much higher. Not necessarily the hours that people work, but more, just the tighter focus, more meetings, more accountability. And that's, that's what drove it forwards, right? As well as just like, hey, like, the thought of this company becoming a losing culture, like, I won't, I won't have it. People know that. And, you know, I don't want to say that I put the fear into the team, but like, at some point you got to kind of show up, right? And we didn't show up for a couple of months. Everyone can have a bad week, about two bad weeks.

Stuart Mitchell [00:34:53]:
Like, I get that. But like, over a six, eight week period, to not be good enough is not good enough. And that puts you in a very precarious situation as an employee of like, hey, like, if I'm going 60, 90 days without placement, like, I gotta start thinking about it. But, you know, again, if you want to buy yourself some credit, do an 80k month, dollar month and it's like, okay, like, remind everyone, the superstar, that no one cares what you did August of last year or December of last year or February or even like two weeks ago. No one cares. Recruitment forgets. Every time you do a deal, it resets, right? And that's it. Like, cool.

Stuart Mitchell [00:35:24]:
Like, there's no point living. There's so many people in our industry that live former glories. Honestly, I've seen so many of them. And later years they'll bounce around agencies and tell everyone how good they used to be. And I joke about it when I say, hey, I used to be good. I'm still in this every single day and I'm still very tight on my own performances and what I'm doing and why I'm accountable for. There are plenty of people out there who do want to live off past glories. And again, the second you've done a deal, the clock resets on the first of every month, first of every week.

Stuart Mitchell [00:35:54]:
No one cares what you did last week. No one cares what you did last month. You have to go again because it just. Recruitment forgets.

Benjamin Mena [00:36:01]:
I want to switch gears and this is definitely for the us listeners. Most of the people that listen to this podcast are based in the US. I think it's like 90%. So what is the difference between UK recruiting, US recruiting and why did you want to build something different from the UK structure?

Stuart Mitchell [00:36:16]:
From a viewpoint of what the industry is in the US versus the UK, I think it's a more respected profession in the US in the UK, it is very much like realtors and, like, very much. And they get a lot of hate this, but good care. 80% to 90% of people that go into the industry in the UK, somewhat uneducated, realize that it's a way to make a buck and don't necessarily treat the industry if they know they can make a buck. So they'll do really well out of there. There is an arrogance about UK funds coming to the US that they think they do it better, which I think is bullshit. Like, I. I genuinely don't agree with that viewpoint. I've been here for ten years.

Stuart Mitchell [00:36:55]:
Some of that. Look, are there some wonderful recruiters in the UK? Of course there are. Right? The best people I've ever met, the 710 $12 million billers. Right? I've met like eight figure billers in the US. I've never met anyone like that in the UK. Like, to me, that is just so insane. And it's a multi billion dollar industry over here, so there's just a lot more. I think one of the biggest, I think, like, cultural differences is split desk model is much more of a thing in the US than the UK.

Stuart Mitchell [00:37:26]:
We run a little bit of a hybrid where we have some full desk folks and we have some delivery function and it depends on job flow, but the split desk thing, and even there's the traditional 360, which is very, very british, that kind of do everything, which again, if you're a solopreneur or kind of run out, you went through a 360 plus and you do everything. You have the 180 model. And even in the US, there's like 120, they call it, where it's account management, sales and recruiting. So there's lots of different nuances of how to do it. Over here. Look, I think over here, the earning upside is insane. I think you can bill and also make millions of dollars in recruiting. And I've been it.

Stuart Mitchell [00:38:07]:
I've lived here and I have a much better standard and quality of life than I would have had in the UK had I applied myself in the very same way. Just because I think the level of opportunity and honestly, just the us ethos around, like excess and huge opportunity, it's just, again, it's a capitalistic marketplace and if you want more, you can go and get more and take more. And I like that. But I would say it's a much more positive industry in the US in terms of how it's seen, how respected is by clients. Look, not everyone loves us, not everyone's going to love me, not everyone's going to love you. The game is the game. And there's always going to be that argument of ta versus exec search versus contingent recruiter. It happens in every country, happens in every industry and that's just always going to be a thing.

Stuart Mitchell [00:38:58]:
But ultimately I just think there is a lot more opportunity out here. And I think again it's a much more respected profession versus if I look at how many agencies they are in the UK, the caliber of people that are coming into the business and how qualified they are. And again there is zero barrier to entry to this industry as it is. Which is often talked about pros and cons either way. But theres plenty of businesses and I think that grab shop model of okay lets just get our name out there and spray that requires a lot of traditionally lower paid high volume activity and one out of 20 make it. And that's really just, I mean it's a sad story. And I would guess like in agency recruiting maybe one in 100 are still in around after ten years. I would like that.

Stuart Mitchell [00:39:46]:
You know if you look at the grad crops from the haze and the tech systems and you know the aero tags, like maybe one in 100 stick around in this industry long enough. But I would guess maybe lessen.

Benjamin Mena [00:39:58]:
Oh it's bad. I started in aerotech myself.

Stuart Mitchell [00:40:01]:
Yeah, we always start on a shop like that, right? Everyone has their stories.

Benjamin Mena [00:40:06]:
I got like two questions before we jump over to the quickfire questions. First of all, once again, you give a shit about respect for your organization, but you're also doing something that most other recruiting companies have not done. Like you've brought on industry advisors. Yes, or an industry advisor. Why did you do that? How has that set you apart from being different from everyone else?

Stuart Mitchell [00:40:25]:
So I think the first thing is, it's always good to have a canary on the pulse of your reputation. I've obviously mentioned reputation seven or eight times. My view on reputation could be very like, I could have these rose tinted glasses and in the corporate slack channels or at the events it could be shirts full of shit. We don't like it. If I have somebody on the inside who is validating that my content and my output and the quality of my work is first class in a very, very respected. We're not talking about a guy, we're talking about the first Esau Red air, the chief security officer at Slack. Very well respected person within my industry and respected by his peers as well. And then when we're spitballing ideas, I'm looking at, okay, what can make us different? What can make us more interesting? And there are some things that will be coming as an add on to who we are, but around the core of hiring, like, who better does pitbull from someone who actually would see value in the product and can be, like, beta test without my needing to angle? And I think, like, having somebody who I can bounce ideas off and look, the third reason is it looks great, right? If I speak to people and they're like, okay, well, what do you do differently? I'm like, okay, well, I have one of the most respected chief security leaders on the planet that gives us advice and has attached themselves to me and to our brand, which is unheard of, like, at that.

Stuart Mitchell [00:41:46]:
I know some people do it, but of his caliber and level. Like, I don't know that there is a bigger security leader in the industry attached to a staffing company. I would doubt it. And it is just a huge tip box that somebody like that and somebody who I like and respect as a person trusts me enough to put their brand against me.

Benjamin Mena [00:42:07]:
How'd you even have that conversation? Like, how'd you get them on board for something like that? Cause you don't see this in the staffing industry.

Stuart Mitchell [00:42:12]:
So he's a us person, but he actually relocated to the UK and he was finding a new job out there, and we were talking about some things, and he was giving a lot of advice to me, which, again, we've worked together a couple of times. I had some great memories together as well, but he started to give a lot of advice, and I was like, if you genuinely buy into this and you think that we can do something here, I would love to make this a little bit more official, and then we can make it kind of work for both sides. Not that I don't appreciate the free advice, which is wonderful, but I think, like, I valued it very much. And so I actually kind of said, like, hey, well, why don't you come on in an official capacity? He's a voice sounding board to the team. He'll come to our holiday party. He's super useful for us as a teammate, and that's so, so, so important. But I didn't want stuff for free, even though I appreciate it. And, you know, somebody's that for coming to.

Stuart Mitchell [00:43:07]:
If they want to come on a journey with us and take us somewhere potentially amazing, they should absolutely get those.

Benjamin Mena [00:43:13]:
That's awesome. And my last question before going to the quickfire is you launched your company, right, when you had a baby.

Stuart Mitchell [00:43:19]:
Yeah.

Benjamin Mena [00:43:20]:
How did you, like, you know, having a newborn and having your young family is time intensive.

Stuart Mitchell [00:43:26]:
Yes.

Benjamin Mena [00:43:27]:
For somebody else out there, like, what's the advice that you have for, you know, people that have a new family while still trying to build a company, be a top biller, run a team?

Stuart Mitchell [00:43:35]:
Yeah. Um. It's tough, right? I probably didn't nail the time in Hubbard's, have a mega supportive partner, which I do. My wife is a wonderful teammate, and so that's so, so important. She gets it. She understands the bigger picture, some good upside for her as well, and life going well for us, and so she gets Ryan. It's not like I was ever a 40 hours week person at my previous company anyway, so it wasn't like a huge uptick. Candidly, I burnt hobbies for a little bit.

Stuart Mitchell [00:44:03]:
I know it's, you know, it is the nature of the beast. But I wasn't super social for a while. I did what I could, but the priorities were the baby in the business and my marriage. And even like, candidly, the marriage stuff was something that took some time as well. Right? Like, honestly, having a business, having a new baby, it was like, wow, there all these new things. And I felt like my wife and I for a little while, and anyone who's maybe in this situation with young kids, sometimes you're like ships passing in the night and that takes work and that's something that, you know, you have to focus on. And I think we're kind of back where we wanted to be in those early months. That was difficult.

Stuart Mitchell [00:44:36]:
But again, like, full support from her, which is super useful. The second is, and I think in the early days, particularly when you're on your own, you can't complete recruitment, so most staff can wait. Again, I'm not saying work 20 hours weeks, but create healthy boundaries. Either go to an office or set time when you're going to shut your laptop, because you can go till 11:00 every night, wake up, open your laptop at seven and just go again. Spend a little bit of time with baby overnight and just fall into this, like, repeat, repeat, repeat. You actually lose productivity because you just go on to autopilot and it's on a bit of a blur. So set really clear and healthy boundaries of when you have time for the family. Let them know that, hey, we're going to the playground, five till six, then I have to go back online.

Stuart Mitchell [00:45:25]:
This is what I need to do. But communicate those gaps with your family so that you can get some time, whether it's in the day, whether it's at the end of the day. I always, always, always protected bath and bedtime like that has never been a time that you can book out. In my calendar from three months to now, she's two and a half. That was always been a time where if I get nothing in the day, I get that.

Benjamin Mena [00:45:46]:
Oh, awesome. So jumping over the quickfire questions, they do not need to be quick answers. What advice would you give to a brand new recruiter that's getting started in our wonderful world this year to succeed?

Stuart Mitchell [00:45:57]:
Yep. Treat people like that, you're going to run into them in ten years time. It's essentially if you treat people like a commodity, then you'll get the exact same respect in return. If you treat someone like they're going to be a client in ten years, you'll just have a much better experience with that person. The second thing is work with an agency that shares that mantra. If they just want you to go bang, bang, bang, bang, bang and not care about the people, you're going to find it really difficult to make a career out of this. You're going to be changing industries every year in this game. Like one industry, longevity is absolutely your friend.

Benjamin Mena [00:46:29]:
Same question. But for people that have been around the block 510 20 years, what advice would you give to them to see success?

Stuart Mitchell [00:46:36]:
I think at this point you should know what you're good at and double down on that. I think there's this obsession about being this super well rounded recruiter. And you don't have to be. You can be a bad cold caller and still be a good recruiter. You can be like, unbelievable. You be a bad specker. You might not be good at specs, but do what you're good at, whether it's creating communities, whether that's hosting podcasts, whether that's specking, whether that's creative texting, whether you're really good in person and you can go to an event, double down on what you're good at. Stop trying to be okay at everything.

Stuart Mitchell [00:47:10]:
Like, because then you just get left behind. Because there will be someone better than you at every cog, if you do every cog. So just make sure that you double down on the thing that you're great at.

Benjamin Mena [00:47:20]:
Like, I know in some other podcasts you talked about, like, not being the best and the cold calling. Is that why you doubled down on LinkedIn?

Stuart Mitchell [00:47:26]:
LinkedIn and in person?

Benjamin Mena [00:47:28]:
Yes, because I think you mentioned, it's just like, you know, always looking for a shortcut. Most recruiters are, but you found shortcut that works for you and you just went boom.

Stuart Mitchell [00:47:35]:
Yeah, I'm bold enough. Right. If it works. Like, keep going until it doesn't. Right? If you find a money hole, don't go and look for another money hole. Just keep taking from it. Keep taking from it until it runs out. You don't need to.

Stuart Mitchell [00:47:46]:
You don't need five. Like, if you find a money hole, keep taking the money out of there. Stop worrying that there might be more elsewhere.

Benjamin Mena [00:47:53]:
Has there been a book that has had a huge impact on your career and business?

Stuart Mitchell [00:47:57]:
Yes. The seven habits of highly effective people, I think is a classic. I think it really allows you to a figure out what you want to do and who you want to be, but also understand the psychology of why people act the way that they act in. I think where, you know, what. What you realize when you take a step back is a lot of recruiters are very selfish. A lot of people are doing things to get something back, and they don't really see the psychology of what's happening at the other end. A lot of people, like, I'll give you an example. Right? Let's say it was a verbal offer that went out on Thursday, right? Like, last Thursday, didn't go, you know, verbally accepted, whatever on Monday.

Stuart Mitchell [00:48:31]:
Like, recruiters getting really stressed about it, right? Like, I might get the offer. I'll get the offer. I'll get the offer up. Because that's how they've been trained. The client candidate don't give a shit. Like, they're fine. Like, no one's in a rush. It's the recruiter is making it about them, and that's because they're coached.

Stuart Mitchell [00:48:43]:
The time kills all deals and whatever. If you start using language like ASAP or whatever, it's really only for you, right? You're doing it for yourself. And that never works. Like, in the reality of being really successful in our industry is never about us. Like, it's actually never, ever, ever about us. It's about connecting two people, or more than two people, and getting out the way. Like, and that's, you know, obviously you want to give them a great journey and that experience and really kind of velvet glove that. But I think we never really understand the psychology of why people respond the way they respond.

Stuart Mitchell [00:49:11]:
And I think the seven habits really gets it under the hood of, like, okay, well, I'm doing this, but, like, I'm interpreting the world in a very different way. And everyone interprets the written word, the spoken word, the pictures, in such a different way. If you don't understand that, like, you're really going to struggle to connect with.

Benjamin Mena [00:49:28]:
People, you've made a ton of placements. And you're really good at the personal connection.

Stuart Mitchell [00:49:34]:
Yeah.

Benjamin Mena [00:49:34]:
Do you have a favorite placement story?

Stuart Mitchell [00:49:38]:
Yeah, there's a couple. One is, I think this is like a week before COVID as well. So there's a guy who is desperate, like, really wanted this job down in, like, costa mesa. I was living in LA, down in Costa Mesa, and his bike broke down the night before. And he's like, hey, I gotta dip out. I was like, dude, I think there's a pandemic coming. Like, I'm serious. So I drove into the, I did a 120 miles round trip, drove into the interview, walked in, said hey to the Ciso, somebody I know well.

Stuart Mitchell [00:50:06]:
Sat basically in the lobby talking to receptionist for like, 4 hours, driving back, got the job. I thought that was a pretty sweet one. And then there's a couple of examples of people in my industry not necessarily hiring, but complaining about a problem. Like, okay, well, we, you know, as an example, we're spending too much time and money automating questionnaires or whatever. You know, it actually made more sense. Okay, well, I know somebody who can do that and build your system to do it whilst also doing it themselves. So I've created placements out of conversations. Like, hey, speak to Andy, speak to Jeff, speak to Helen.

Stuart Mitchell [00:50:38]:
They can fix that for you. So I think there's a real, like, I love it when you basically create a placement when there's nothing there, and it's just a really, really good feeling. And then, look, I have a couple of, like, situations where I pick it, like a perm job up in the morning. Like, hey, like, I need you to speak to, like, I know someone for that. I'll set up, like, a sleigh of interviews, and on same day, like, it's happened like, four or five times in my career where it's like, hey, like, know the person. Stay on the line. I'm gonna call them while you're on the line, see if they're interested. I'm gonna get you on a slate of interviews, and we'll get them to start Monday.

Stuart Mitchell [00:51:08]:
Like, those ones are sick. Like, it rarely happens, but if you know your market and you're like, okay, I need them to speak to Hamid or whatever. Like, speak to them. I'll get them on the line today. We'll get this done by end of day. Those ones are always nice.

Benjamin Mena [00:51:21]:
That's an absolute power move. I absolutely love that. So you've been like, a seven figure builder even before you started your own business. You're crushing it with your own business. You've attracted such a talented team of high performers at your core, what do you think has been the reason why you're seeing success out there?

Stuart Mitchell [00:51:38]:
These are two probably not the most altruistic answers, but some of it is spite. There's a couple of people along the way that have told me that I'm a fad and it's never going to work out. And some of it is the chip on the shoulder thing of like, hey, watch this and send. And then some of it is just like, I was a fairly decent athlete without not being massively naturally athletic because I'm very competitive and I hated to lose. And I think there's always that argument, love to win, hate to lose. I'm a hate to lose person, and I think it just spurs me on. And I think, you know, add to that, I'm a. I'm a provider for my wife and daughter.

Stuart Mitchell [00:52:14]:
I went through the phase of liking materialistic things. Not that I don't like nice stuff now, but I think, like, in the early days, it was to get the Porsche and the apartment and whatever, and I've been through that, and I will say, like, that stuff runs out. It grows tin quite quickly, and now it's more like, okay, well, I want to buy back time, but I also really want to, like, I really want to enjoy this. And I think, like, the more, the more I enjoy it, ironically, like, the more success I have. Because when I'm doing this with a smile on my face, working with clients that I like and candidates I want to do well with. And also, like, my team is, like, high performing, and I, you know, everyone, I think on my level has hired somebody or given a grad or whatever, and you're like, this person is just an idiot. And it's just, oh, I can't stand this person, but I can't work with them. Well, they're on another team and they just drive me crazy.

Stuart Mitchell [00:53:03]:
I don't have that because it's my company. Right. And so it makes me so happy that I get to, like, enjoy the people that I deal with on a daily basis and I get to create that. Right? And it's not, you know, I'm not just going to hire a bunch of people that I like because it's my hangout, but I want to work with a bunch of people that I respect and I get to control that destiny in terms of, like, the root of the success. It's been a lot of hard work. It's been a lot of fear of failure. It's been a lot of, you know, pushing things through, but I also don't want to let anybody down. Like, I still, you know, again, family.

Stuart Mitchell [00:53:30]:
But, like, even when I'm taking a job brief, right? Like, I like these people that I'm working with. I never want to let them down. I never want to let the candidates down, never want to let, like, my team down. And there's times where I'll superman a moment to kind of get things going again. But, you know, I've always kind of taken that mantra on my shoulder of, like, bleed from the front and be the guy.

Benjamin Mena [00:53:50]:
Absolutely love that. And I know that you've had hard days. You know, 2024 has also been tough for you personally. How do you get through some of those hard days as a recruiter and get out of that funk?

Stuart Mitchell [00:54:02]:
I always say, look, whenever I have a bad day, it's just recruitment, right? Like, the majority of my job is getting quite wealthy people, slightly wealthy. Like, I know it sounds like I'm not. I'm not outside, like, you know, job centers or whatever, getting people their first job, it's not as ultra recruitment is never as ultra stick and as, you know, love and soft ears as people from the outside seem to think it is. Like, we're not helping people get jobs. We're attracting really high caliber talent and making corporations do better, which I'm okay with. But, like, if I have a bad day or a bad week, like, you know, the reality is a. No one's life has been ruined. Like, nothing is in that situation where the stakes are that high.

Stuart Mitchell [00:54:40]:
And look, the reality is, like, I stay very emotionally flat. You'll never see me like, fist bumping or cheering or whatever because I know this game. The reality is, like, if you look at it from a very far distance, it's always just a little bit up. Realistically, it is like that. Like, the highs, lows, highs, lows, highs, lows. If you let your like. And this is, I think, more of a junior thing to do. But some people never lose this.

Stuart Mitchell [00:55:03]:
If you go up with the highs and down with the lows too often, like, recruitment will be the crap out of you because it is a very, very tough industry and you'll get a lot of rejection and you'll give a lot of rejection. And it's really, really, you got to be really thick skinned and ready to do that and take the emotion out of it. So I think, like, on the tough days, from a business perspective, look, try and remain as emotionally level as I can. I'm not a hothead. I used to be a big hothead when I was younger. I didn't achieve anything. You know, the reality is you can control what you can control. Our job is so weird in that there is so much that we can't control, which is really difficult for me because I do love to be in control of things.

Stuart Mitchell [00:55:43]:
But I can't change if the candidate's husband decides that he doesn't want to relocate to Denver at the last minute, or I can't change the fact that a client's insurance doesn't cover one very specific doctor, that everyone's got weird stories of why things haven't worked out. If I've done everything that I can in my power to make connections and get stuff going, great. If it doesn't happen, it doesn't happen. And I always say, like, I have some boring cliches at work, but trust the process is like one of my, like, team. Wear it to the cows, come home. But whenever I have bad days, everything will be fine.

Benjamin Mena [00:56:17]:
Awesome. And now, because of, like, you showing up on podcasts, you constantly posting on LinkedIn, I'm sure you have recruiters that reach out to you.

Stuart Mitchell [00:56:24]:
Yes.

Benjamin Mena [00:56:25]:
Like asking for help or asking for advice. Is there a question that you wish they would actually ask, and what would be the answer to that?

Stuart Mitchell [00:56:31]:
That's a good question. First answer to your question. While in the background I think about this is never call me to pick my brain. I'm a business owner. I'm a family man. I'm trying to do the best for my clients and my team. Like, just grabbing 30 minutes with no context is actually quite disrespectful. And I know there's a lot of outspoken recruiters who say very similar things.

Stuart Mitchell [00:56:51]:
We're real busy people. Look, I'm happy to give answers based on where I've been successful, and I'm happy to kind of share, like, draw on things previously, again, like, if someone was to ask me, like, how I got, you know, how I got such a large following on LinkedIn, what kind of numbers I get from the back of it, what they suggest in terms of, like, creating a social media platform or why I chose cybersecurity. If it's a punchy question, there's not, like, one particular one. I think, look, a lot of recruiters and why I'm probably followed by a lot of recruiters is because of my social media presence. I don't really care about the cyber security thing, which. Fine. But I think that if they were going to ask a question and get to the point. It'd probably be one specific to that.

Stuart Mitchell [00:57:32]:
Love that.

Benjamin Mena [00:57:33]:
And this is the last question. We're going to ask this two different ways. We're going to ask this. At the very beginning of your recruiting career, once again, at the start of Hampton north, like, you've had tons of ups, tons of downs, tons of success.

Stuart Mitchell [00:57:43]:
Yeah.

Benjamin Mena [00:57:44]:
Lots of, like, hard lessons. If you can go back to the very beginning of your recruiting career and give yourself advice, what would you tell yourself?

Stuart Mitchell [00:57:50]:
Trust the process. If I could change one thing, I would have actually gone to a bigger company that is arguably harder and tougher culturally. But, like, some of those what feel like terrible company have the best training in the world. And, like, I don't think that my foundational training was great, and I had to figure it out, which is why I had this, like, career renaissance at, like, 26, whereas I see some folks that, like, 22, 23 crush. So I think we could change one thing. It would be, you know, I chased the base a little bit. I got a little bit higher of a base. I should have gone to a business that gave me a really, really solid fundamental training with a huge kind of plethora of high performers that I can follow in, maybe a lot, you know, larger office.

Stuart Mitchell [00:58:38]:
I went boutique early on and kind of scrapped around. So I think understand early in your career, like, who am I learning from and what am I learning? I know this is a really privileged position to say this, but the first 18 months of your career in recruiting, two years, I don't want to say what you make doesn't matter because you have bills to pay, but if you get that right, you can make, like, legitimately ten to 20 times that amount if you get it right in five years versus chasing an extra two k on the basement. Ten k, like, and again, position of privilege. Right. I realize that. I'm saying that because not everyone's situation is conducive to be able to do this, but if you get the training right, like, you can legitimately in three, five years, make 250 grand, make 400 grand, like, versus having to, like, piecemeal it along the way, which is how I did it.

Benjamin Mena [00:59:27]:
And the same question, but looking at the very beginning of Hampton north.

Stuart Mitchell [00:59:31]:
Yeah.

Benjamin Mena [00:59:31]:
Everything that you've gone through, the hiring, the success, the late nights, the freaking out about the money.

Stuart Mitchell [00:59:36]:
Yeah.

Benjamin Mena [00:59:37]:
If you could give yourself advice, what would you give yourself?

Stuart Mitchell [00:59:39]:
Delegate. Delegate early. Whether that's hiring outside, I shouldn't be spending 2 hours reading contracts or going through video editing or booking flights. This stuff that I was doing that I could get somebody to do for 1015 bucks an hour. When I look at how I view my time or delegating certain things to team members who enjoy it and feel responsible do that, I reckon I probably set fire to 500 hours, like, at least, which is six months worth of work on stuff that's worth like $20 an hour. So ten grand. Whereas if I'd have made one placement in that time, if I'd have just hired somebody to do it or delegated, like, absolutely. That.

Stuart Mitchell [01:00:19]:
That's probably the biggest thing, like, done. And there's so much stuff that I hate doing as a business founder. A lot of it is admin based, and I do it, and I would do it like it's my business and I'm making myself miserable, like redlining documents and stuff like that. It's just. It was stupid.

Benjamin Mena [01:00:35]:
Well, before I let you go, if anybody wants to follow you, how did they go about doing that?

Stuart Mitchell [01:00:40]:
I live on LinkedIn, so that's the. That's the best place for me. I'm sure you'll drop it in the comments and. Yeah, Stuart Mitchell on LinkedIn. I'll definitely be the first person that comes up under that name.

Benjamin Mena [01:00:49]:
And before I let you go, is there anything else that you would love to share with the listeners?

Stuart Mitchell [01:00:52]:
I think the biggest thing is to. As someone who, like, has learned this along the way, you're probably never as bad as you think you are, and you're probably never as good as you think you are. A lot of that will be. The industry will always ebb and flow, stay humble when things are good and double down when things are bad. Everything will always be okay as long as you keep pushing.

Benjamin Mena [01:01:09]:
Well, Stuart, I just want to say thank you so much for coming on. I've been looking forward to this interview for a while. You've built an absolute team of killers, high performers in an industry that's had its. I want to almost say it's downs recently.

Stuart Mitchell [01:01:21]:
Yeah.

Benjamin Mena [01:01:21]:
And you're still, like, out there absolutely crushing it with your team. So, you know, I know there's a ton of lessons here that recruiters could take home, and I hope they did. And for the listeners, I hope you make 2024 your best year at keep crushing it, guys.