Building Resilience: The Habits and Mindset of Successful Recruiter with Ricky Paloy

Intro [00:00:00]:
Welcome to the elite recruiter podcast with your host, Benjamin Menna, where we focus on what it takes to win in the recruiting game. We cover it all from sales, marketing, mindset, money, leadership, and placements.

Benjamin Mena [00:00:18]:
I'm excited about this episode of the elite recruiter podcast. I have my special guest, Ricky Pouloy, who is an executive headhunter in the health care leadership space. And the reason why I have him on the podcast is We're gonna talk about a big thing that holds a lot of recruiters back from success, mindset. Getting your mindset Properly put together, built so that way you can win in the recruiting space. So, Ricky, welcome to the podcast.

Ricky Paloy [00:00:49]:
Thank you so much, Benjamin. How are you doing today?

Benjamin Mena [00:00:51]:
I'm doing good. It's a we're recording on a Friday, so definitely excited.

Ricky Paloy [00:00:56]:
That's great, man. I'm very excited to be here. Thank you for having me.

Benjamin Mena [00:00:59]:
Well, as we get started in the this podcast, the first thing we talk about is, how did you even get started in the recruiting space?

Ricky Paloy [00:01:08]:
For sure. Yeah. So my story starts back in 2012, after the, mortgage crisis in, you know, 2000 In a 2007 and into 2009, I ended up getting a position with University of Phoenix, as what we called an employee education services adviser, and I helped with the students to actually get into school. So the students that worked at the university. And during that time, I was in that role for about three and a half years and wanted to do something different, move into, like, a leadership role, something like that. And it ended up going into A few different areas, and I found faculty recruiting. And so I got into faculty recruiting and did that for about just under a year before A few things happened there and ended up moving into the other side of it, going into, like, a recruitment manager position for, another school company that was in third party things, And eventually was in that whole side of things for about 6 years. So then I've been and ended up going to the other side About back in, gosh, back in 2018, I've moved over to the other side and started doing the agency and search firm side and have been doing it since.

Benjamin Mena [00:02:16]:
That's phenomenal. And so you you didn't start off in recruiting straight out of college. You moved into that, like, later on in life. Yeah.

Ricky Paloy [00:02:24]:
I mean, I'm you know, I just turned 44. So when I graduated, I graduated a few years. Didn't quite make it in the 4 years that most people do, due to a few things that happened in my personal life. But, after I graduated, I, ended up, it was a tough decision, but I ended up going into the mortgage business at for you in 2004. And I was an account executive for a mortgage lender, so I went to different different brokers that didn't necessarily have their own bank, and so we would sell our services for some of their clients. And so did that for about 4 years with the top producer for the client, and, of course, kept making more sales until, Yeah. Every year, I made more sales, but I made less money, so it didn't really make sense to me. And then next thing you know, it was it was the other side of it.

Ricky Paloy [00:03:06]:
Of course, everything happened, And, unfortunately, it was no longer in that industry. So a lot of us took a step back and tried to figure out what was next, and that's kind of how I Fell into or, I guess, got the job with University of Phoenix.

Benjamin Mena [00:03:20]:
That's phenomenal. And for the listeners, what are you doing now, and what is your business about?

Ricky Paloy [00:03:25]:
Yeah. So now about four and a half years ago back in March of 2019, we started and I founded and started Reem Recruiting, and we are a search Firm that works with the health care space mostly on leadership positions, so management all the way up to c suite. And then we also do some Provider positions, not so much the physicians, but your nurse practitioners, PAs, psychiatrists, and then we will also focus on depending on the client and the partnership that we have with them, We'll do some of their professional roles. So for example, 1 client I just placed, a chief information officer, and then another client of mine, I placed, an HR recruiter. So it just kinda depends on what the client is and how and how we work. And we also work with clients all throughout the United States. So it's not just, I'm based out of Phoenix, Arizona, but we have clients everywhere. I mean, probably about I think since we started having clients about two and

Benjamin Mena [00:04:15]:
a half, 3 years ago, I'd

Ricky Paloy [00:04:17]:
say we have about 32 or 33 clients that we have been working with, and then, we have obviously, not all of them are active all the time, but, you know, sometimes we have companies that'll come out of the blue and say, hey. We worked with you last year. We wanna go ahead and work yeah. So that sometimes happens as well.

Benjamin Mena [00:04:31]:
Oh, that's phenomenal. So wanted to really just jump into mindset. What is your thoughts? First of all, that separates an average recruiter from a great recruiter.

Ricky Paloy [00:04:44]:
Yeah. So, Benjamin, like, my big three things that I talk about are Transparency, credibility, and then follow through or follow-up. Those are kind of like my 3 mantras. So In this process and the way that we do things is we wanna make sure that we take care of people all the way through the process. So when we're having conversations with potential clients, things like that, The big thing is the mindset of like, hey. I'm here to help you guys, and if they don't wanna reciprocate that, there are other clients out there that do want that type of relationship. And so I think what happens sometimes when people are starting off in this industry, you know, you're just trying to find whatever you can to place or whatever you wanna do. And, Of course, I mean, you have to make money, but at the same point, like, I try to really focus on clients that would make sense for us and not just the ones that I wanna bring on because I need the money or we need the avenue.

Ricky Paloy [00:05:35]:
It's more of really partnering with both clients and just taking a step back and understanding, like, you're gonna have difficulties throughout this process.

Benjamin Mena [00:05:43]:
And as a recruiter, if you're either new in the space or you've maybe hit, like, a a plateau, how do you get that self confidence To a place where you can be like, I am choosing these clients. This is this is what I'm working on. I'm not chasing every single thing that And, I mean, how much time do you spend on a a bad client, but that's a whole another story. Yeah. So how do how do you how do you how do you get yourself to that place To have that kind of confidence when you're working these searches.

Ricky Paloy [00:06:12]:
For sure. So, I mean, it all goes back to your mindset. Like, this is what you talked about at the very beginning of this. It's Understanding that there's gonna be difficulties, and not every day you're making revenue. Right? You're setting up specific actionable items or what I call and Other people call nonnegotiable habits to create certain things. So certain days, I have business development calls, or or at least outreach. Right? Certain days I have where I'm gonna just Focus on reaching out to and sourcing for candidates. And I have that structure set up because there are days that things get thrown off, And I wanna make sure that I'm able to get back to what I need to do to be successful.

Ricky Paloy [00:06:47]:
And there are long breaks of sometimes we don't have Placements and there are times where 4 placements happen all in a row. So it's just understanding the ebbs and flows, and, obviously, we could get into, you know, the other side of it of, like, how you pay yourself and all of that, but, you know, that's being able to have a income coming in from that, revenue that you've created for yourself And not having to stress over when's the next check coming, can be very, very helpful in that in that whole side of it as well. Yeah. I need to have, like,

Benjamin Mena [00:07:15]:
a whole episode just talking about money, but, like, let's have this one focus on mindset, if that's cool with you.

Ricky Paloy [00:07:20]:
Sure. Most definitely.

Benjamin Mena [00:07:21]:
Now you you mentioned this thing called nonnegotiable habits For Successes Recruiter,

Ricky Paloy [00:07:25]:
what are those? So these are gonna be habits that you have that are normally daily, and they can be a lot of different things. They can pertain to not only business, but they can pertain to a lot of the things that you have from a personal

Benjamin Mena [00:07:39]:
perspective.

Ricky Paloy [00:07:39]:
So for example, I'm a I'm a big gym guy. I love going and lifting weights. Not so much good on the diet part of it, but, I love lifting weights. Love, you know, doing as much as I can, and and that gets my mindset straight a lot, especially if I'm having a, a struggle or whatever, but a lot of times, you know, for about I mean, I'll go back, like, 6 months ago. I was going to the gym every morning. It was, It was a nonnegotiable habit. I would go every morning, and I did that, and I made sure that that nonnegotiable habit occurred every single day. And I think during the process of, like, 3 months, I only missed, like, 1, maybe 2 days, and I think I was sick on both of those days.

Ricky Paloy [00:08:13]:
And it's just basically pertaining to yourself of, like, making yourself You're holding yourself account I mean, especially if you're a leader and you're trying to hold other people accountable. If you're not holding yourself accountable for those things, are you gonna get anything done? How is anyone gonna listen to you? And it's not just even in the business aspect of it, but it's also in, like, your family and your friends and everything else. So I just there's different authors out there and different guys. One of the guys that you know, he's a little bit outside the cusp of recruiting, but and very much outside the the cusp of Recruiting, but, Wes Watson was a guy that I had followed and started talking about nonnegotiable habits, and that was when I was like, That really triggered me to start Putting those in and then rereading James Clear's atomic habits was another one where you can really set those specific things that you're gonna do. And It could be little things even like making your bed every day, you know, going for a walk in the morning. Again, just those little things to get you Ready for the day and putting your mindset right.

Benjamin Mena [00:09:12]:
It's it is so funny how things outside of the recruiting space And outside of your recruiting habits have an impact on your recruiting business and your recruiting desk. It's crazy. Like, you're working out every single morning.

Ricky Paloy [00:09:26]:
Yeah. I mean, it's you know, and things change. Right? Like, I did that for about I think I had it set for a number of days, and then we changed that. You know? It's always about going for for the specific things that you wanna do at any given time. And that could be like, hey. I wanna bring on 2 new clients by next week, or, hey. I want to get you know, we have a new search or something like that. One of the things that I try to promise all my client I do promise all my clients, and I will give them updates if it doesn't happen.

Ricky Paloy [00:09:48]:
But majority of the time, I will have a candidate to them within a week. And it's not gonna be the way that we do things is kinda unique in that what at least the way that I think we do. We we do a lot of things up front. We're very concierge. It's kind of a a service of we're really doing, like, almost like a behavioral, analysis of that candidate because I'm not diving into a lot of their work history per Per se, like, what did they do here? What you know, how many people are they, you know, overseeing or what projects? I'm I'm more asking them and try to get them to feel comfortable to open up to me so that way they're not just giving me surface level answers during a conversation. So when I when we go through that, we have a lot of people that will end up opening up and really telling us what they're really looking for in this next opportunity. And it might not be the right fit for that client, but then it might be. And and when we're able to go through all of that and have that conversation up front, it really helps to To to ensure that they are gonna be a potential good position or a good fit for that company in that position, man, that all goes back into habits.

Ricky Paloy [00:10:47]:
It all goes back into mindset. If I Wanna adjust how I do that, or if I'm having a bad day and I'm not doing the right things for the candidates and the client on a specific screen, Maybe I'm screwing up that really great candidate, so I have to be on top of the game when I'm talking to everybody.

Benjamin Mena [00:11:03]:
You've done a great job, like, developing a strong foundation for your mindset. The daily habits that you've kept up of yourself, like, day in and day out, I think have also helped. You know, it's helped win in the recruiting space. Did you have that mindset all along, or is this something that you, like, ran into a wall or struggled with and had to develop?

Ricky Paloy [00:11:23]:
Yeah. So I think we all have these things that we structure that we would consider habits, and we may not even realize their habits. Right? There are things that, Yeah. We just do maybe unconsciously. And whether those are good or bad, they can be good. They can be bad. They could be things that are detrimental to yourself or others, but they can also be really good for you and yourself and then others as well. It it just depends on what those are.

Ricky Paloy [00:11:44]:
So we all have those growing up. I think, you know, one of the things that Happened to me a few years ago was getting diagnosed with ADHD. Always knew something was off a little bit when I was growing up, but It was one of those things where it's like, okay. What what is this all about? And then when I got diagnosed, a light kinda went off. I'm like, oh. And you start going through, you know, the different Thoughts. Right? Like, I'm upset. I'm happy that I know now, but and, again, I don't wanna define myself into that.

Ricky Paloy [00:12:13]:
But when you start having those Conversations to yourself and you're like, that's why when I was in college, I needed to be in this little square, you know, office area and have nothing else around because I couldn't concentrate. You know? Or that's why I do certain things and that you never realize that. So I created a lot of habits when I was younger to Figure out how to work through those things and being able to you know, I'm an introvert, but I come off when I talk to people as an extra extrovert. It's it's very It's a unique situation, and it's very much a, an ADHD thing. And so I have to like, my objective is to ensure that I allow people to Come into this in my life, in my head, and and understand what I'm talking about and what I'm thinking because those habits that have been created throughout the course of time I've gotten me to where I'm at. But then at the same point, now that I understand this, I've had to create new habits. I've had to go through that process and understand, like, This isn't good for me. This is maybe what I need to do here.

Ricky Paloy [00:13:12]:
Why am I doing this? Okay. Let me figure that out. And it's a daily struggle. It's never it's never easy. You know, and and that's just how I've kind of adjusted throughout the years.

Benjamin Mena [00:13:24]:
And I I know there every single person out there has Their own story, their own struggle, the things that they're going through. And I love that you're talking about having to figure out how to Structure your life with that. When it comes to because you've you're you've recently discovered this and recently going through it, ADHD, what are some of the things that you had to implement for your life once you've learned that about it?

Ricky Paloy [00:13:52]:
Yeah. So If I go back to when we started the company, so just to give you a little bit of, information on that, I had left, you know, corporate HR talent acquisition and went into an agency, search firm for and I was there for about a year, and I learned a ton. You know? And it just got to the point where it was like, you know what? It's It's time. There's some things that I I wanna do differently and some things that I didn't necessarily agree with. And so I'm like, you know what? Let's do this. So started my own thing and went from making pretty good money to nothing. And so when you start developing those things in your head, like, how am I gonna do this? Right? It wasn't easy. I mean, I had to go drive Lyft, you know, on Uber for 6 months before I could really start to have some, you know, substantial income coming And so I was, you know, 2 jobs.

Ricky Paloy [00:14:41]:
You know? And I and I'm not trying to say I'm better than anybody because everyone, you know, has their, like you said, their struggles, right, and the things that they've had to go through. But I knew just from that standpoint of, like, what I needed to do. And so when I set that mindset of like, okay. I gotta go do this from 10 to 2, and then the the rest of the day is gonna be for recruiting or however I had it structured. We've I've personally built in those those little things that I need to do To make sure and and for me, I think the big thing is having a set schedule. It it really helps me out, because if I don't have that set schedule or, like, for example, like, I have my keys in the same place every day. Right? If I have my wallet, if I put it somewhere else, I don't know where it's at. Yeah.

Ricky Paloy [00:15:24]:
And and I'll tell I could tell you a funny story about something else later. It it was one of the probably one of the worst ADHD moments of my life, But, it was it was hilarious, and and my wife let loves to tell this tell the story, but I I just think you have to really and even right now, like, me trying to tell you about what you're asking me about and what I've done. Like, I'm I'm going all over the place. Right? And that's that's what happens here, but it it's one of those things where, you know, Come back to where I need to be. Okay. This is what I'm trying to do. This is what I need to do now. And even during work.

Ricky Paloy [00:15:54]:
Right? Like, put the phone on do not Sure. Make sure that I turn off my emails, things like that, especially if I'm sourcing, because you know how it is with sourcing. When you're when you're headhunting and you're sourcing and You get distracted and then try to go back into it. For me, it's it's a nightmare, but I have to be really cautious on that and ensure that I am spending that, You know, maybe hour, 2 hours, 3 hours, whatever it may be, and then also give myself grace. You know, focus on the small wins. Right? And that's something else that I can talk about as well, but turning negatives into positives. That's another big thing that I try to make sure that I do with myself. Awesome.

Benjamin Mena [00:16:32]:
Now Real quick. When you just made the jump from an agency to your own firm and to your own dream, You drove Uber for 6 months.

Ricky Paloy [00:16:42]:
Yeah. Something like that. Mhmm.

Benjamin Mena [00:16:44]:
And it's it's one of the things I think a lot of people like. You know, once you start your own firm, like, it takes a little while for the money to come. But you did whatever you had to do to to chase your dream Even if it require you doing something else on the side while you're building up your book of business. During those times when you were driving Uber, why Didn't you quit?

Ricky Paloy [00:17:04]:
I think at that point, I you know, and, again, this is and, again, not to make that the ADHD thing part of this whole thing, but, like, that was before, You know, I it was before I knew I I I had it. I mean, we all thought I had it. I mean, I had a feeling. It was there's jokes about, you know, squirrel, you know, that kind of thing. But, Yeah. Exactly. Right? And, there's all those types of jokes, but I think the big thing is, like, I just knew that so I Benjamin, I wanted to, I wanted to own my own business since high school. I just I I knew I wanna do something in sales.

Ricky Paloy [00:17:36]:
I knew I wanted to do something where I helped people. I I didn't know exactly what that was, but I never got that. Like, you know and, unfortunately, my dad passed away when I was, 18 well, 19, my freshman year of college. So I didn't get a lot of guidance From him, obviously, because he had passed and and what to do in these next steps. And my mom didn't have that knowledge. And so I I hung on to some different people. I hung on to some, you know, Mentors, I guess, or whatever you wanna call it. And as you're going through that process, I just stayed in kind of like outside sales, corporate America.

Ricky Paloy [00:18:08]:
Never really thought then, of course, you know, I should have done it when I was younger. Just didn't think about it. You know? I didn't I didn't really go down that road because I was Doing other things. And so next thing you know, I'm married. My wife has 2 boys from previous, and then we have kids. And so, you know, we have 2 kids as well, so we have 4 overall, but then you're sitting there like, am I ever gonna start this thing? Like and we sat down and and, you know, sit. We prayed on it, and we figured out, like, what's next. And, hey.

Ricky Paloy [00:18:38]:
Let's make this happen. Right? And so that's where When you're sitting there driving and dealing you know, I think the big thing that I was dealing with is how can I make this thing, this Lyft driving, Treblooper driving, how can I make that a positive? You know what I mean? I I didn't look at it as work. I looked at it as, like, I get To participate in getting to get better communication skills and getting to know people, and that's what I do as a recruiter. Right? That's what we do as recruiters. If you're doing it Anyway, I believe that's the the the connection with people. And so I was able to, I mean, kinda train if you wanna look at it From from that perspective. And that's, again, going from, you know, multiple hours and and weekends and nights and all sorts of stuff to Let's get this going, and that's that's I don't know. That was my mindset back then.

Ricky Paloy [00:19:28]:
It's like, I'm not gonna let this fail. And even after COVID hit, and I can tell you that story too, but, yeah, it's just let's keep going, and we'll figure out what we need to do.

Benjamin Mena [00:19:39]:
One thing I have seen with people that are Okay. You know, handling multiple things or making that job while still, like, You know, driving Uber or something like that, the hours that you've spent recruiting, you probably, like, made those the most effective hours, period. Right?

Ricky Paloy [00:19:54]:
I mean, you you try to, You know? But it sometimes it doesn't pan out. You know? Sometimes it does. You know, again, sometimes you get distracted, you know, and and you have To do things maybe, like like, a Saturday morning. Right? Like, come in and you know, I have my own little office now, you know, and I'm just I'm a solo Preneur, I have a couple, you know, recruiters that work underneath me occasionally, but, you know, you have to put the time in. Like, it's just It depends. So, yeah, if if you can't figure that out then, then do something else during that time to be productive, or figure out how do you get your head back into that space, Or, hey. This I'm not right for this right now. I'm not gonna do a good job.

Ricky Paloy [00:20:34]:
Let me take a step away for a little bit, and then I can come back. And and that's harder when you're doing multiple jobs like that or or whatever else. You know? And and it's it's difficult, but I I Personally feel from a mindset perspective, you have to be able to adjust, and and especially if you get you know, I think burnout kind of BS. I think I don't. I mean, it's I can spend 4 hours in a row on sourcing, and you get done. You're like, oh my gosh. My eyes. You know? But, You know, it's hard to really I think it's really difficult to get burnt out unless you're putting yourself into situations that shouldn't happen or Gotcha.

Ricky Paloy [00:21:10]:
Allowing yourself to be in situations that shouldn't happen.

Benjamin Mena [00:21:13]:
Well and 1 last question on this. For the person that's sitting in out there that has a family afraid to make the jump. What advice would you give to them to prepare to make that Jump themselves.

Ricky Paloy [00:21:27]:
So that's a hard question to answer without really understanding the person that you're sitting across from. I do have a coaching client that I'm working with right now that wanted to do that. And just to give you an idea of his expertise, He was mostly a corporate recruiter, so he didn't really have the agency side of things. So we dove into those things. But the big thing that we ended up Understanding from his perspective of, like, how does he build this this business that he wants to create? Go get the experience. Right? Like, If you wanna if you're interested in this, then go get the experience. Go work for a search firm. Go work for a large company.

Ricky Paloy [00:22:02]:
Go work for a small company. Learn that industry. I mean, I worked for a pretty small company and learned a ton from them because they'd worked in huge companies, and they understood a lot of different things that I didn't necessarily know, so I got to sit back and learn from great mentors in my eyes. You know? And like I said, it it's just depending on what that person is ultimately looking to do, then it then the answer depends. If, for example, they have a ton of experience, right, working agency, Then you gotta figure it out. Right? What do you wanna do? Do you wanna take a loan out? Do you wanna work a 2nd job, or do you wanna stay at your current job? Will your current job allow you to do something on the side? You know, that kind of thing. Well, if they find out, well, you know, you're not gonna tell them. If they find out, are they gonna let you go? Like, These are all things that you have to think about.

Ricky Paloy [00:22:49]:
And so I always suggest putting down some sort of business plan and then understand, like, what type of business that you wanna do. Like, what is that? You know? And there's, You know, again, in the recruiting world, there's different types of businesses. Right? We all know there's search firms, there's agencies, there's staffing, there's All these different things. And so, you know, I ended up niching into health care leadership roles. It just tends to be where I feel the most comfortable, And maybe when the company grows or if someone else wants to get into that type of world, then, you know, I can help them out with that. But it's it's just it all depends on what they wanna do, but it's it's the biggest thing is learning. Creating habits, learning, and then figuring out, like, what you wanna do. And then once you have that set up, then go after it,

Benjamin Mena [00:23:33]:
and that's it. And we're gonna, like, dive in this for just a few more seconds, and then we're gonna jump to something else. When you were at that search firm, were you planning on having your own company one day and you were just knowledge and learning the ropes while you're there, or do you just kind of, like, happen that you made the job?

Ricky Paloy [00:23:47]:
Not initially. I always I always thought that I might wanna do that, and I did wanna get into that world. But when I did take that opportunity, it was To to learn that side of the business and then, you know, go from there. I didn't know at that point that I was gonna jump in, but As I learn more and more, I realized, like and just, you know, again, some of the comments that you get and when you have people that I mean, if you were to look at my LinkedIn profile, you can see I have, like, over 40 recommendations from people that I've directly worked with. You know? And not and I'm not talking about this, you know, the the 99 plus thing. Like, I'm talking like people spend time to write a nice paragraph or 2 about what I've done. And As you start to learn what your your strengths are, right, work on those, continue to grow those, and, obviously, you're gonna have the things that you need to work on as well that are not strengths, but, You know, really dive into what you're good at, and I feel like what everyone always tells me is like, hey. You have a good flow to you the way that you speak.

Ricky Paloy [00:24:49]:
The conversations that you have are really good. You can get people to open up. And so that's where I knew having probably more of the leadership style of Of recruiting, working with leaders was gonna be a better fit for me than than more of the entry level. And that's not to say that I can't do entry level. I've done tons of entry level positions or Mid level positions, but it's it's just what are you good at, focus on those things, and then, you know, continue to grow and develop, Like, who you wanna be as a person because we're we're all we're all messed up some way. Right? But how do you take the positive out of that and actually continue to develop and grow? That's what's important.

Benjamin Mena [00:25:26]:
Well, got a question for you. When it comes to, like, business development, do you, like, do you have a great tip for the listeners that's working for what's working right now?

Ricky Paloy [00:25:36]:
So it's been difficult. 2023 has been a difficult year. So, just to give you a quick backstory, In 2019, when I started, I worked for a third party, when I saw I was 10.99 through another company, running everything through my business at that point. But They gave me a small stipend to start and then was kinda working through that for the 1st few months, and then it took off from that perspective. And then you sit back and go, okay. What's happening here? I realized I made and just I mean, I'll just be honest. I think I made within, like, 6, 7 months have made, like, $50,000, something like that. So not not a huge amount, but went from, you know, nothing to that in in but then I'm thinking like, Well, what was my split? And then you start thinking, well, they're probably made $150,000 off of off of me.

Ricky Paloy [00:26:25]:
Right? Because they're they have the clients. So that's right when COVID hit. Was the end of was, like, in 2020 or so is when I was like, oh my gosh. I don't know what to do. And near the middle to end of 2020, we're like, how do we find some some different you know, I wanna find my own clients. And so that's when we, I invested and I found a marketing company. And honestly, I used link LinkedIn. And the problem now LinkedIn is not working like it used

Benjamin Mena [00:26:55]:
too. But back then, it

Ricky Paloy [00:26:55]:
was very much me going and, I used a couple I mean, I'll just be completely honest. I was using a company called I was using sales navigator through LinkedIn, and I use a company called ULink. And it basically sends messages, automated messages to connect with, And there's different ones out there. There's Job Inn, and there's a bunch of other ones out there that can do similar things. And then it basically connects with them, and and then we put a campaign in there. And they did that for me, and that's how I got my first, like, 2 clients within, I think, a couple weeks after we started. And then it just snowballed. So I do a lot of that And then also a lot of referrals, people, like, from that perspective.

Ricky Paloy [00:27:31]:
But, again, it's like we're a smaller company. So in 2024, The plan is to grow and develop it and and bring on business development person, figure out how to do that, or potentially hire a contracting company to help Do that from that next step because my my objective is to grow into 2024. But, initially, that's how I did it, and I still use that to this day. And every time I do 1 campaign, I normally get 1 to 2 clients out of it.

Benjamin Mena [00:27:59]:
That's awesome. So Well, Before we jump over to the next part of the podcast, is there anything else that you would love to share about mindset?

Ricky Paloy [00:28:08]:
I mean, I think the biggest thing is just understanding, like, who you are. You know, really take a step back and say, like, what are you good at? What are you not good at? And then set up expectations and, again, those nonnegotiable habits for yourself if you're trying to build the business or if you're trying to you know, whatever you're trying to do. Right? Doesn't necessarily have to be a business. It can be like, I wanna go do in the Ironman, or I wanna lose 50 pounds, or I wanna do this. Like, whatever that is, you have to set up a plan of action. You can't just, You know, willy nilly, and it goes against anything else that I believe in, but it's just you have to do those things because if you don't, You just you won't hold yourself accountable. You won't continue to move forward. I mean, Benjamin, this year's been so like, it was so rough because we had months there when I was Focusing on the coaching business and not really doing the recruiting business, and then I sat back and go I mean, I got some.

Ricky Paloy [00:28:58]:
I got a few clients, but I missed the recruiting, and I was like, okay. I'm gonna double down on this, and that's where the second half of twenty twenty three has been much, much, much better. But it's still been way down from 2022. So, again, I'm going off on a tangent a little bit, but it's just the mindset has to be there. Like, No matter what you're doing, you have to continue to go after that even if you find it difficult, even if you don't wanna get up at 5 AM, even if you don't want to, Yo. Do the dishes at home. Like, these are things that you have to do because if you don't, they will create chaos and you will not accomplish things that you need to do.

Benjamin Mena [00:29:34]:
Chaos prevents accomplishment.

Ricky Paloy [00:29:37]:
I think so.

Benjamin Mena [00:29:38]:
Love that. We'll flip it over to quickfire questions. And These don't have to be quick answers. What advice would you give to a brand new recruiter that's just starting off In our industry,

Ricky Paloy [00:29:54]:
listen as much as you can, learn as much as you can, and then do as much as you can. So don't worry about being wrong. Don't worry about messing up something because you're going to. I still mess up it. We all do. Right? There's it just happens. But sit back and just watch people, listen to people, Listen to how they talk to people. You know? And then you do your own research.

Ricky Paloy [00:30:24]:
Like, find other people that do this. Like, why do they do it? What what's important to them? And, again, that's not just recruiting, but it it's for recruiting, like, you have to learn the conversation part. I there's a there's such a difference between corporate recruiting in my eyes. Not all, but I'm stereotyping and Critiquing a little bit, but corporate recruiting is very much here's the questions that we have. I need to get these answered, and then I'm gonna go on to the next person. Right? We're a search firm where agency is much more tell me about yourself. Like, what you know, why are you interested? Hey. I saw you went to school here.

Ricky Paloy [00:30:57]:
What made you go get your law degree, And now you're in health care. What what happened there? Like, to help them to feel comfortable. So just being able to ask a lot of questions and sit back and listen at the same time.

Benjamin Mena [00:31:10]:
Now it's the same question, but for experienced recruiters, people that have been around the block for years. 5, 10, 20, 25 years. What advice would you give to them to see success and be sick and stay successful?

Ricky Paloy [00:31:24]:
I mean, again, it depends on the person. Right? So I think from an overall encompassing, you just have to love this. If you don't love it and you allow yourself to become stagnant, I mean, I can become stagnant in a day. You know? So you you have to have to reimagine what you deem as The next thing. Right? Like, maybe that's setting up a specific goal. Like, I wanna be able to talk to 10 people this week. I I'm just making up numbers, but or 10 submissions. Right? To either you have to have goals because eventually, these are gonna get to the point of you're doing the same thing over and over every day.

Ricky Paloy [00:31:59]:
What can you do different? And so it depends on if do they want to start their own business? Do they want to, gross more? You know? Do they wanna what do they wanna do? I guess it it all depends on that. So I can't really answer it without talking to someone specifically, but I think that would be the biggest thing is just setting goals for yourself.

Benjamin Mena [00:32:16]:
Awesome. Has there been a book that's had a huge impact on your own personal success?

Ricky Paloy [00:32:20]:
I mean and, again, not to go back to the Wes Watson thing, but I were I read the Wes Watson book, Which is basically him. It's it's called incarcerated. So he came out of the and it's very it's very brash. It's a brash book. It's it's very much like your habits are gonna be what makes you successful. If you don't have these habits, You're the only one that's holding you back. And then, you know, again, I think I mentioned earlier as well, Atomic Habits was another good one. Mindset by Carl Dweck.

Ricky Paloy [00:32:54]:
That's a really, really good book if you haven't read that. I read that probably Five and a half years ago, I need to read it again. And then there's some other ones that I've have on my on my desk that I haven't started yet, 4 hour work week's another one by Tim Ferris, things like that. And I think one of the issues I run into is actually putting the time into the reading. Right? You know, we get distracted easily or I do when phone pops up or Instagram or Facebook or whatever. Right? So, you know, setting a Setting time aside for that, but those I think those are some of the ones that I would recommend right now.

Benjamin Mena [00:33:27]:
I don't know. Yeah. I'm with you. It's like I Don't laugh. Sometimes I do my best reading at a bar. Go sitting at a wine bar. I I

Ricky Paloy [00:33:36]:
I don't know if I could do that, but Fine. When I read, I have to I do it in 2 places. 1 is I'll have headphones on like you do, and I'll put I'll either put white noise in. Normally, it's white noise or brown noise, but normally white noise. And, I can do it on the treadmill if I'm walking on a treadmill, if I try to actually get cardio in, and, Or I'll do it, like, at home, but it's hard at home for me because of the distractions of of of the family and the dogs and all that kind of stuff. So Sometimes when I come to work and and that's a new habit not a new habit. That's another habit that I need to reimplement is I was giving myself 30 minutes of reading time every morning, but when I got into my office. And that kind of you know, something pops up on your email, and the next thing you know, you're an hour into work.

Ricky Paloy [00:34:17]:
You're like, oh gosh. I so, again, that's an excuse. I'm making an excuse, but That's where again, going back to doing those things and getting that done is what I need.

Benjamin Mena [00:34:28]:
What's your thoughts on AI and the future of recruiting?

Ricky Paloy [00:34:32]:
Everyone no one knows yet. Like, that's the thing. Like, no one knows what it's gonna end up being like. I do know having real conversations with people, Even if AI can have a conversation eventually and have that mentality, like, to be able to do that, it's not the same. And and the intricate details of being able to explain, like, you know, hey. This is what this guy's personality came across, like, when I'm having this conversation, or, you know, they're getting back to me quickly. Right? If AI gets to the point of, like, moving people through processes and things like that, Like, you're seeing that with Zapier and all these different, you know, tools that are out there to be able to move people through processes. And so it's gonna be really interesting.

Ricky Paloy [00:35:11]:
I know there's some recruiters out there that are scared that they're like, we're gonna lose jobs. I don't know. Maybe. But it could open up other jobs as well, so it'll be interesting to see. I I do use Chat GPT occasionally On certain things, on, you know, certain things that I work on, and, yeah, it just depends. But then other times, it's like I do my own stuff too. So I I don't know. I'm I'm just here for the ride, I think.

Benjamin Mena [00:35:36]:
Be a fun ride. I'll just say that. Yeah. Yes. So looking back at your own personal success, do you think has been a a big driver for that for yourself?

Ricky Paloy [00:35:47]:
I mean, I guess you I guess it depends on what you consider success. Right? For me, looking back at going from basically, you know, No revenue the 1st year. I mean, like I said, I made that $50 in the 6th month, but that was towards the end of that that year. Right? And then going up to almost a100, then, you know, 300 plus and then, you know, just whatever. When you start looking back at it, like, I was able to help that many peep And from a success perspective And also from a, you know, revenue perspective, that was, like, more money than I had ever made in my life. And so when you start looking at some of those things and figuring out, like, What did I do well? What can I work on? What can I continue to develop? Those are things that are gonna be important for me. And so I think success I think the biggest thing is looking at your own success and who you are and not looking at other people and what they have or they don't. Keep it to yourself.

Ricky Paloy [00:36:44]:
You know, are you doing what you need to do to be successful? You know you're if you are, you're not. You know if you spend too much time on Instagram. You know if You didn't do the sourcing that you needed to do, call yourself out on. Right? Or have a partner to call you out on it, you know, that kind of thing. If you're not sufficient enough to be able to do that yourself, some people can't. So have someone that can say, hey. Did you get this done today? Shit. No.

Ricky Paloy [00:37:06]:
I didn't get it done. What do I need to do? And and it's just making sure that you're holding yourself accountable to be able to continue to develop again. It goes back to The mindset thing and having these habits of ensuring that you're driving forward. And I think there's too many people that Take a you know? Well, that wasn't my fault. Oh, well, this happened, so I wasn't able to do this. Well, no. That's your fault. You allowed that to happen.

Ricky Paloy [00:37:31]:
And if you didn't allow it to happen, How do you change that into a positive? What can you do differently? You know, what does that look like? And so, again, that's that's some of the things that I think I personally deal with.

Benjamin Mena [00:37:42]:
So I'm gonna ask this a question kind of like about your recruiting career. So put the put the recruiting hat on. Okay. With everything that you've that you know now, everything that you've gone through, the ups, downs, learning about business development, learning about your firm, If you could sit down with yourself at the very beginning of your recruitment career, have a cup of coffee with yourself, what would you tell yourself?

Ricky Paloy [00:38:08]:
That's a great question. It doesn't come overnight. Celebrate the small wins. I would say get a coach. For me, personally, get a coach to help me develop how to create the next part of the business. Now, you know, I think if I would've done that, I'm I'm about to do that now. We're we're looking at getting a a coach To help with that next step. I know you had a coach on on your podcast a couple times, and one of them that I think you worked with specifically that I can remember her name.

Benjamin Mena [00:38:41]:
Trisha?

Ricky Paloy [00:38:42]:
Pitching so out of Illinois, I think, if I remember right. I was watching that podcast. That was really good. But just, you know, helping to how do I take the next step? How do I pay for employees? How do I I don't know how to do those things. Right? I can ask and I can get some some tips. Right? But, Ultimately, having someone to, again, coach you learn from, because people have done these things that you haven't And or I have. And I think being able to really understand that and maybe that's just because I grew up without, again, without The dad in my early part of my career, I didn't really seek that out. I didn't seek that.

Ricky Paloy [00:39:22]:
I I was like, I can do this myself. I can Do it, you know, but there's a point where you have to have even if you're a solopreneur, you still have to have a team behind you. Some way, somehow, you know, whatever that is, a great CPA, a great business coach, whatever. You I feel like you have to have and then Just learning. Right? Actually, read more. Do things like that that I I probably didn't do as much as I should have when I first started.

Benjamin Mena [00:39:48]:
That's great advice, Ricky. Well, Ricky, before I let you go, this has been a phenomenal interview.

Ricky Paloy [00:39:55]:
Thank you.

Benjamin Mena [00:39:57]:
One of the reasons is because it's so relatable. But But before I let you go, is there anything else that you would love to share with the listeners?

Ricky Paloy [00:40:03]:
I mean, I think one of the things that I didn't really get into too much was the you know, we were talking about the mindset side of thing, but When something negative happens, right, and you go, why did this happen? Like, why me? Right? What you have to look at it from the positive perspective, and I'll give you an example. So when I was working for a company, I had got promoted. When I was a recruiting manager for this company, I got promoted to an operations manager. Pretty much same pay, but now I was gonna oversee a whole team. I was gonna be basically the in between of sales and compliance. And I learned so much. A ton. Right? Working way too many hours, just learning about people's personalities, who they were, like, what corporate America is all about, Understanding those different things and then going and getting laid off.

Ricky Paloy [00:40:56]:
Having to lay off a couple of my employees and then myself getting laid off. And, and I sit back and and one of the people that I know that worked there with me, different area, but he's like, aren't you upset that they laid you off? And I said, no. I'm not. I'm excited that I got to learn so much, and I'm excited that I got to learn so much and that I was, like, able to develop those skills. And that was Better for me to be able to understand what I've 1, what I wanted to do next in my career, but 2, to be able to continue again, develop and grow. Understand what that is. And growing doesn't necessarily mean, like, you have to, like, keep taking steps up. It can be improving little things.

Ricky Paloy [00:41:38]:
Like, I think that would be the the thing that I I'm talking about. Even right now, like, With as as tough as 2023 has been from a recruiting perspective because so many clients are like, we're not hiring or we're putting these on hold or, Oh, we're not entertaining new new agencies, all that kind of stuff, and it is opening up a little bit now. But, just, Okay. What's what's the positive of these things? I can work on these other things while this is down so I can continue to again, whatever that may be. So Just understanding that the negative things aren't always negative. Even you know? Shit. I don't even wanna say this, but even if, like, there's something that happens health wise to someone. Right? Maybe that's a step for you to say, okay.

Ricky Paloy [00:42:17]:
Well, the positive is I know now I need to get better at this, or I need to lose weight, or I need to eat better, or I need to exercise or I don't know. I need to read more so my brain works better. You know? Whatever that is. Right? Just those things will help you to understand what's important, and That's that's what I think people sometimes forget.

Benjamin Mena [00:42:37]:
Talk about a great way to finish the interview, Ricky. Thanks,

Ricky Paloy [00:42:40]:
man.

Benjamin Mena [00:42:41]:
Alright. Guys, for the listeners, I'm excited that you guys got to listen to this episode, and I can't wait for you guys to crush this year. So go get it, guys. Thank you for listening.

Intro [00:42:52]:
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